Transcript
WEBVTT
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The following is paid programming.
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Welcome to Something More with Chris Boyd.
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Chris Boyd is a certified
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financial planner
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practitioner and senior
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vice president and
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financial advisor at Wealth
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Enhancement Group,
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one of the nation's largest
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registered investment advisors.
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We call it Something More
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because we'd like to talk
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not only about those
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important dollar and cents issues,
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but also the quality of
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life issues that make the
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money matters matter.
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Here he is, your fulfillment facilitator,
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your partner in prosperity,
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advising clients on Cape
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Cod and across the country.
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Here's your host, Jay Christopher Boyd.
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Welcome to Something More with Chris Boyd.
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Thanks for being with us for
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another episode.
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I'm here with Jeff Perry as
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my co-host again.
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We are both of the AMR team
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at Wealth Enhancement Group,
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and we are joined for another segment in
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By Marsha Mantel.
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And we had a great conversation.
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Part one, if you missed it.
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We were talking more about Medicare topics,
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a little ERISA,
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and we started to go down
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the social security topics
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and we got really... Sidetracked by Irma.
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Yeah, Irma took us off the track,
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off the rails.
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And so we wanted to spend a
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little more time with
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Marcia to talk about some
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social security topics.
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Social security is one of
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those subjects that
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everybody wants to talk about,
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wants to learn more about.
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We...
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We haven't,
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when we've had the radio show in the past,
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callers would light up the
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lines with questions
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because everyone has their
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unique issues of what about this?
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Or what about that?
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Very common kind of things
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relate to people who work
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in the public sector,
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but might be eligible for
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social security or divorce.
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Yeah.
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Lots of these kinds of issues that will be,
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you know,
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Nuanced questions, you know,
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that it's not just as
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straightforward all the time.
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So let's talk about a
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variety of these kinds of
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things that you've given us
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a few thoughts for topics, Marcia,
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that have been coming up in
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your inquiries.
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And I'm sure we'll chime in
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with a few that have come
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into some of our
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conversations with clients today.
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One that you mentioned as a
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starting point was the idea
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that what if someone wants
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to retire a little early
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and they don't quite have their 35 years?
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Because explain why that's
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relevant to 35 years.
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The basics of the calculation.
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Oh, sure.
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So Social Security is a calculated benefit,
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and it is based on your personal,
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every individual person's
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own earnings history.
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So back in 1979,
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when I worked at McDonald's that summer,
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well, that $125 is on my statement.
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It still counts.
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It does still count.
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Now, you hope it doesn't count.
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Right.
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You'd rather not have only
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one hundred twenty five
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bucks on your as one of
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your thirty five years of
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highest earnings.
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So is that actually something you had?
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One hundred twenty five
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dollars is literally my
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very first W2 job.
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Yes.
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Yes.
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Babysitting and whatever.
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Babysitting didn't count.
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That's right.
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Yeah.
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The cutting the lawns for me.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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Exactly.
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So it's fun to see when you
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look at your full earnings
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statement and to see like,
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what was I doing in 1979?
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Oh, the summer before college.
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Right.
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So you need each person for
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the calculation to ideally work.
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You need 35 years of
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earnings that are as high as they can be.
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And that's different from eligibility,
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though, right?
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That's correct.
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This is the calculation for
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your insurance benefit.
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But that's a great point, Chris,
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because to be eligible to
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even get a calculation,
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you need to have paid into
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Social Security for 40 quarters.
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They don't have to be
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consecutive quarters.
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They can be, you know, 10 quarters.
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Part-time in high school or whatever.
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That you're, you're earning,
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I call earning chips, right?
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You're earning your chips so
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that you now are eligible
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for social security,
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not only your old age and
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survivor benefits, but,
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But also disability benefits
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should you be one of the
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many people who ends up on SSDI.
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So it is important to earn
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those little chits.
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And you do that by earning a
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certain amount of money.
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It's determined every year.
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I think this year it's, I don't know,
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is it $1,500 a quarter or $1,800?
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I'm sorry, I didn't look that number up.
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It's not a lot.
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It's not a big number.
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But can I ask you,
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does that same eligibility...
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impact one's eligibility for Medicare.
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Sorry to go back to Medicare again.
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See how easy it is?
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Yeah.
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But I remember a long time ago,
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I had a client who just was like,
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I'm not eligible for Medicare.
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I was like,
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what do you mean you're not
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eligible for Medicare?
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It's the 40 quarters.
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It is.
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I mean, FICA really is
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One coin, two sides.
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So Social Security is on one
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side of that coin.
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You know, heads and tails is Medicare.
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It's Medicare Part A. And so
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when we talk about being
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eligible for Medicare,
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people do use these generic terms.
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All they're talking about is
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Medicare Part A,
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the premium free part of
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Medicare for hospitalization.
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And that's what your FICA is
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covering as you pay into the system.
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So yeah, your 40 quarters,
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once you or your spouse, not a partner,
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but a spouse,
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once you meet that 40 quarters,
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it qualifies you for Social Security,
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for Disability, for Medicare Part A,
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no premium.
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I'll put one asterisk on this.
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Yes.
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There are professions,
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there are government
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workers who pay into Medicare,
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but not into Social Security.
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You are correct.
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Good point.
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Yes.
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Someone may not think that.
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So they may still be
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eligible by virtue of that
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Medicare premium, that tax.
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For Medicare.
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Yeah,
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that they've been paying out of their
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payroll.
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Even if they.
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Even though they're not
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participating in the Social
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Security system.
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That's right.
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Yeah, great point.
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Great point.
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And this is it.
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Everyone's situation,
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exactly what you said, Chris,
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is so different.
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Yeah, a lot of asterisks.
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Yes, a lot, because, you know,
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individual divorced spouses, you know,
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it's like, I'm not eligible for Medicare.
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Well,
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if you met all the rules as a
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qualifying divorced person, oh, yes,
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you are, if you're qualifying.
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You know,
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so it's these things that don't
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just assume that because
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you don't look like the
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general rule that there
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isn't something that
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applies to you instead.
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Good points.
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In that 35-year calculation,
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back to a woman who may
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have been out of the labor
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market and have a bunch of zeros,
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does even working part-time
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before retiring,
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like knocking out a zero
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with $10,000 make much of a difference?
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Is it better or not?
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Yeah.
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It is always better to have
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something north of zero.
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Now, will it change your benefit from, say,
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$1,300 a month to $4,000 a month?
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No, it will not.
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But as we move into old age,
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every dollar matters.
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And every guaranteed dollar
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is much more important.
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I get the question sometimes,
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usually from a husband who says, oh,
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my wife has 38 credits.
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And she hasn't worked for
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the last 25 years.
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She was home with the kids
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and running the house.
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Should she go back and get
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those last two credits?
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In that case, the answer is no.
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Because she will never have
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enough of a benefit in that
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few years that would exceed
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half of his full retirement age benefit.
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As a spouse,
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she's entitled to half of his.
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That's her maximum benefit.
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And that works great for that family.
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That's how they decided to
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run their entire family.
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But you don't have to go
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back even if you're unless
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it makes her feel better.
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So here's the other thing,
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that emotional side.
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Yes.
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It's really hard to find out when you're,
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say, 62, that you have no worth.
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Right?
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It looks like,
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what do you mean I don't
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even get my own social security?
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Yeah.
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So if it's going to make her happier,
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have at it.
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She's going to get the same amount,
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you know, half of his,
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but she'll get her own payment first,
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and then a big spousal top up.
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That makes sense.
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We have clients who we've
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had this come up a couple
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of times where this off your plans,
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some of the comments you
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thought we would want to talk about.
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But this is a real life issue where.
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We need to talk about the WEP.
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And we have clients who are
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very close to their
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eligibility for a public pension.
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Should I become eligible for
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that public pension?
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You know,
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two more years and I can at least
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have some eligibility.
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Am I better to like get that eligibility?
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Become vested.
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To be vested for a public pension.
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Ten years in Massachusetts.
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It may not be, you know, full, you know,
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pension or something, but something,
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right?
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Yeah.
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Or am I better to not have
00:09:32.456 --> 00:09:33.398
that interfere with my
00:09:33.437 --> 00:09:35.379
Social Security calculation?
00:09:36.740 --> 00:09:37.080
You know,
00:09:37.400 --> 00:09:40.302
and should I just stay on the
00:09:40.322 --> 00:09:41.644
Social Security, you know,
00:09:41.783 --> 00:09:42.823
numbers and not have it
00:09:43.245 --> 00:09:44.745
interfere with those calculations?
00:09:44.785 --> 00:09:45.767
Because sometimes you're
00:09:45.787 --> 00:09:46.746
thinking about I have to go
00:09:46.787 --> 00:09:48.288
back to the government work
00:09:48.307 --> 00:09:48.948
for two years.
00:09:49.229 --> 00:09:49.408
Yeah.
00:09:49.589 --> 00:09:50.590
So I'm going to lose two
00:09:50.629 --> 00:09:52.692
years of Social Security earnings, right?
00:09:52.792 --> 00:09:53.631
Yeah, that's right.
00:09:53.652 --> 00:09:54.352
That's very common.
00:09:55.666 --> 00:09:55.826
Yeah.
00:09:55.905 --> 00:09:57.606
And there's no really good answer here.
00:09:57.866 --> 00:09:58.187
Right.
00:09:58.327 --> 00:09:58.567
It is.
00:09:58.587 --> 00:09:59.727
It's a pass.
00:10:00.649 --> 00:10:05.731
You know, the look of that situation.
00:10:05.991 --> 00:10:07.852
So I had a slightly different version,
00:10:08.232 --> 00:10:08.994
which is someone who's
00:10:09.033 --> 00:10:10.794
getting the public pension.
00:10:11.595 --> 00:10:14.817
But he also worked like
00:10:14.876 --> 00:10:16.538
every summer doing consulting work.
00:10:16.577 --> 00:10:18.278
An engineer was working for the state,
00:10:18.480 --> 00:10:20.581
but he had a lot of FICA wages.
00:10:21.738 --> 00:10:23.899
But he didn't have his 30
00:10:23.899 --> 00:10:25.961
years of substantial earnings yet.
00:10:26.301 --> 00:10:27.282
Which is a different number
00:10:27.322 --> 00:10:29.123
than the qualification number.
00:10:29.322 --> 00:10:30.264
Yes, it is.
00:10:30.764 --> 00:10:32.024
And substantial earnings,
00:10:32.065 --> 00:10:34.346
I don't mean like we get to decide, oh,
00:10:34.527 --> 00:10:35.607
you had plenty of earnings
00:10:35.648 --> 00:10:36.368
or substantial.
00:10:36.427 --> 00:10:36.869
No, no, no.
00:10:37.249 --> 00:10:39.350
Everything is clearly defined in the law.
00:10:39.370 --> 00:10:40.551
What does it mean?
00:10:40.571 --> 00:10:42.893
There's a number and it changes by year.
00:10:42.913 --> 00:10:44.193
Every year you need a little bit more.
00:10:44.673 --> 00:10:46.975
So he was looking to avoid WEP,
00:10:47.556 --> 00:10:49.317
the Windfall Elimination Provision,
00:10:49.417 --> 00:10:50.418
entirely because
00:10:50.677 --> 00:10:52.298
by fully vested in his
00:10:52.339 --> 00:10:53.259
pension on this hand,
00:10:53.698 --> 00:10:54.578
but going back to the
00:10:54.960 --> 00:10:56.639
private sector for five
00:10:56.679 --> 00:11:01.542
years to get up to his 30 years of life.
00:11:01.562 --> 00:11:03.022
Actually,
00:11:04.423 --> 00:11:06.442
it's wonderful because if you can
00:11:06.682 --> 00:11:07.803
have your pension,
00:11:07.844 --> 00:11:10.284
your vested pension in the state,
00:11:10.384 --> 00:11:10.924
it's great.
00:11:11.750 --> 00:11:16.471
and a fully unreduced social security.
00:11:16.490 --> 00:11:18.211
So WEP doesn't- Can you explain?
00:11:18.272 --> 00:11:21.113
So if one has 30 years, as it is,
00:11:21.373 --> 00:11:23.854
of social security- 30 years of FICA.
00:11:24.374 --> 00:11:25.974
FICA contribution earnings.
00:11:26.313 --> 00:11:27.053
Substantial earnings.
00:11:27.414 --> 00:11:29.554
Substantial, and that's a threshold.
00:11:29.674 --> 00:11:29.894
It is.
00:11:29.934 --> 00:11:30.916
It's not a huge number,
00:11:30.956 --> 00:11:33.176
but it's not $1,500.
00:11:33.176 --> 00:11:35.037
It may be, over the last few years,
00:11:35.116 --> 00:11:36.456
it's probably up around $30,000.
00:11:36.456 --> 00:11:37.057
It's about $30,000, yeah.
00:11:40.472 --> 00:11:42.234
And someone like that who's
00:11:42.254 --> 00:11:44.235
a consultant versus a camp counselor.
00:11:44.255 --> 00:11:44.975
So here's where we get.
00:11:45.235 --> 00:11:45.355
Now,
00:11:45.395 --> 00:11:46.437
what if you're a public school teacher?
00:11:46.456 --> 00:11:47.217
Just to finish that thought,
00:11:47.298 --> 00:11:48.778
if you have the 30 years,
00:11:49.739 --> 00:11:51.500
then there's no exposure to
00:11:51.539 --> 00:11:53.341
the windfall elimination provision.
00:11:53.381 --> 00:11:53.662
Correct.
00:11:53.761 --> 00:11:54.381
That is correct.
00:11:54.722 --> 00:11:57.644
And if you have at least 18,
00:11:57.644 --> 00:11:59.405
jump in if I'm going off memory.
00:12:00.304 --> 00:12:01.946
Between 18 and 30 is a scale.
00:12:01.966 --> 00:12:03.287
It's a sliding scale about
00:12:03.326 --> 00:12:04.268
what would be reduced.
00:12:04.508 --> 00:12:04.768
Okay.
00:12:04.807 --> 00:12:05.188
That's right.
00:12:05.208 --> 00:12:06.549
Because it starts at... So
00:12:06.590 --> 00:12:08.230
what's happening is... So
00:12:08.250 --> 00:12:10.032
we'll do a little techie moment here.
00:12:10.392 --> 00:12:12.754
Your PIA is your primary insurance amount.
00:12:13.073 --> 00:12:14.215
That's your benefit amount.
00:12:14.576 --> 00:12:14.676
Okay.
00:12:14.696 --> 00:12:15.755
And it has a specific
00:12:15.817 --> 00:12:17.357
calculation based on those
00:12:17.357 --> 00:12:19.339
35 years of highest earnings.
00:12:20.059 --> 00:12:20.220
There...
00:12:21.451 --> 00:12:23.352
You get your average index
00:12:23.432 --> 00:12:24.653
monthly earnings as the
00:12:24.793 --> 00:12:26.154
first part of the calculation,
00:12:26.456 --> 00:12:28.136
and then it's broken into three tiers.
00:12:28.998 --> 00:12:30.899
Most people get 90% of this
00:12:31.279 --> 00:12:32.961
first threshold dollar amount.
00:12:33.361 --> 00:12:34.984
These are all set by the law.
00:12:35.043 --> 00:12:36.125
They change every year.
00:12:37.500 --> 00:12:39.642
Then you get 35% of the
00:12:39.682 --> 00:12:41.403
second tranche and 15% of
00:12:41.442 --> 00:12:42.104
the third tranche.
00:12:42.724 --> 00:12:44.885
Well, with WEP, you start out,
00:12:44.966 --> 00:12:47.447
instead of getting 90% of that first band,
00:12:47.467 --> 00:12:49.629
you only get 40%.
00:12:49.629 --> 00:12:51.191
But then you get to 45, 50, 55.
00:12:52.511 --> 00:12:54.594
So this is the scaling that
00:12:54.913 --> 00:12:56.696
gets you back up to the 90,
00:12:56.696 --> 00:12:57.956
which is what the rest of us get.
00:12:58.197 --> 00:12:58.937
After 30 years.
00:12:59.398 --> 00:13:02.585
So just to put a point on this,
00:13:03.405 --> 00:13:04.447
did I understand that to
00:13:04.488 --> 00:13:06.552
mean that if I'm subject to
00:13:06.592 --> 00:13:08.216
the windfall elimination provision,
00:13:09.355 --> 00:13:11.195
I'm never going to lose more
00:13:11.235 --> 00:13:15.176
than 60% of my Social Security benefits.
00:13:15.356 --> 00:13:17.616
I'd have 40% at least.
00:13:18.057 --> 00:13:19.197
Did I hear that?
00:13:19.317 --> 00:13:19.937
Not quite,
00:13:20.258 --> 00:13:21.778
because it's a calculation of
00:13:21.918 --> 00:13:22.717
three bands.
00:13:22.738 --> 00:13:24.918
It's like your tax brackets.
00:13:25.278 --> 00:13:27.178
So, you know, zero to $10,000,
00:13:27.178 --> 00:13:28.519
we pay zero in tax.
00:13:28.559 --> 00:13:29.840
And then the next tranche, you pay 12%.
00:13:30.580 --> 00:13:32.301
Can I give up all of my
00:13:32.341 --> 00:13:33.681
Social Security benefits if
00:13:33.801 --> 00:13:35.240
I'm subject to the windfall
00:13:35.260 --> 00:13:36.221
elimination provision?
00:13:36.261 --> 00:13:37.402
That's kind of where I'm going with this.
00:13:37.909 --> 00:13:39.051
Oh, great question.
00:13:39.071 --> 00:13:39.931
And no, you cannot.
00:13:40.130 --> 00:13:42.312
The most you can have your
00:13:42.392 --> 00:13:43.812
Social Security benefit
00:13:43.913 --> 00:13:45.974
reduced is one half of your pension.
00:13:47.394 --> 00:13:49.436
OK, but there is a max.
00:13:50.056 --> 00:13:52.397
Is there not a max amount of the reduction,
00:13:52.437 --> 00:13:53.158
a dollar amount?
00:13:54.158 --> 00:13:54.759
There is.
00:13:54.839 --> 00:13:55.999
And it's on that chart.
00:13:56.339 --> 00:13:56.578
Right.
00:13:56.919 --> 00:13:58.500
Somewhere buried in SSA.gov.
00:13:58.900 --> 00:13:59.541
That's right.
00:13:59.600 --> 00:14:00.701
Again, not simple,
00:14:00.802 --> 00:14:02.822
but people who have the pension.
00:14:02.903 --> 00:14:04.582
So back to the original question,
00:14:04.623 --> 00:14:05.903
should this person go back
00:14:05.943 --> 00:14:07.024
and get vested?
00:14:08.073 --> 00:14:08.668
Probably.
00:14:09.587 --> 00:14:11.089
And then you throw in the
00:14:11.269 --> 00:14:13.070
health benefits that go along with that.
00:14:13.149 --> 00:14:14.490
That go with the state pensions,
00:14:14.510 --> 00:14:16.451
which are very helpful.
00:14:16.772 --> 00:14:16.991
Right.
00:14:17.011 --> 00:14:18.393
So you're getting extra
00:14:18.432 --> 00:14:20.014
goods by being vested in a
00:14:20.094 --> 00:14:22.195
public sector job.
00:14:22.235 --> 00:14:23.274
So if you can get a job back
00:14:23.294 --> 00:14:24.436
there for two years, I'd say,
00:14:24.456 --> 00:14:26.236
you have to look at it.
00:14:26.297 --> 00:14:27.576
But on the surface,
00:14:27.618 --> 00:14:28.658
it looks like a good theory.
00:14:28.677 --> 00:14:29.498
Many times.
00:14:29.558 --> 00:14:30.818
And then you don't lose as
00:14:30.938 --> 00:14:31.879
much from your Social
00:14:31.940 --> 00:14:33.780
Security as you think.
00:14:34.100 --> 00:14:34.600
However,
00:14:35.181 --> 00:14:37.482
if your spouse is a dependent spouse...
00:14:38.182 --> 00:14:39.443
meaning she didn't have her
00:14:39.443 --> 00:14:43.626
40 quarters or she is much lower earner,
00:14:44.567 --> 00:14:46.428
her benefit will be based on your,
00:14:46.469 --> 00:14:48.230
we call it the WEP PIA.
00:14:48.690 --> 00:14:50.792
So on a reduced PIA.
00:14:51.913 --> 00:14:52.732
And I will tell you,
00:14:53.634 --> 00:14:55.075
when people find this out,
00:14:55.894 --> 00:14:58.517
they're more mad about this
00:14:58.596 --> 00:14:59.457
than they are about Irma.
00:15:00.110 --> 00:15:01.432
Absolutely, yes.
00:15:01.491 --> 00:15:01.611
I mean,
00:15:01.692 --> 00:15:04.234
they are really mad because there's
00:15:04.333 --> 00:15:05.815
no way on your statement to
00:15:05.975 --> 00:15:07.015
see any of this.
00:15:07.196 --> 00:15:08.537
There's one little paragraph
00:15:08.557 --> 00:15:09.557
that says you might be
00:15:09.638 --> 00:15:11.038
impacted by WEP if you have
00:15:11.119 --> 00:15:12.980
a public message.
00:15:13.379 --> 00:15:13.821
Yeah.
00:15:14.100 --> 00:15:14.681
That's a good point.
00:15:14.721 --> 00:15:16.101
That number on your Social
00:15:16.121 --> 00:15:17.182
Security estimate if you're
00:15:17.202 --> 00:15:20.085
a public employee is not yours.
00:15:20.605 --> 00:15:21.326
It is not yours.
00:15:21.505 --> 00:15:22.986
That's before the WEP.
00:15:23.167 --> 00:15:25.008
They don't calculate it on the statement.
00:15:25.028 --> 00:15:26.830
Even though they may think they know.
00:15:27.409 --> 00:15:28.291
Yeah, they don't.
00:15:28.630 --> 00:15:28.931
They don't.
00:15:29.587 --> 00:15:30.428
No.
00:15:30.448 --> 00:15:31.948
So that's another example.
00:15:32.110 --> 00:15:33.691
It's really important to do
00:15:33.750 --> 00:15:36.172
some planning in advance of
00:15:36.511 --> 00:15:38.092
your decisions because it
00:15:38.153 --> 00:15:39.254
could affect what you
00:15:39.293 --> 00:15:40.575
really have for cash flow.
00:15:40.715 --> 00:15:40.855
Yep.
00:15:40.934 --> 00:15:43.235
And there is a tool, an improved tool,
00:15:43.437 --> 00:15:43.777
I'll say.
00:15:43.836 --> 00:15:44.557
It's better than the old
00:15:44.596 --> 00:15:47.379
tool on SSA.gov that you
00:15:47.438 --> 00:15:49.100
can plug in all the data.
00:15:49.120 --> 00:15:51.041
You have to manually plug in all those.
00:15:51.120 --> 00:15:51.662
Every year.
00:15:51.782 --> 00:15:52.221
Every year,
00:15:52.261 --> 00:15:53.763
which you get from your statement.
00:15:55.464 --> 00:15:56.865
So you can figure out what it would be.
00:15:57.533 --> 00:15:57.673
Yeah.
00:15:57.833 --> 00:15:59.975
I mean, but really it's a 15 minute task.
00:16:00.436 --> 00:16:00.816
I mean,
00:16:01.176 --> 00:16:03.018
and it's typing correctly from your
00:16:03.437 --> 00:16:05.458
full earning statement into the tool,
00:16:05.799 --> 00:16:07.179
but it is very good.
00:16:07.200 --> 00:16:08.301
You also need to know what
00:16:08.341 --> 00:16:09.481
your pension is.
00:16:09.522 --> 00:16:12.024
It shows like, I don't know, it gives some,
00:16:12.384 --> 00:16:13.585
so many years back in,
00:16:14.445 --> 00:16:14.825
Annually,
00:16:14.884 --> 00:16:17.385
and then it goes into bands of 10
00:16:17.385 --> 00:16:19.025
years or something at a time, right?
00:16:19.105 --> 00:16:21.547
Yeah, you cannot use the new statement.
00:16:22.427 --> 00:16:23.988
I'm so upset that they
00:16:24.207 --> 00:16:26.168
pulled off the full earnings history.
00:16:26.589 --> 00:16:28.028
It is so important,
00:16:28.109 --> 00:16:29.850
especially for the advisor community,
00:16:30.210 --> 00:16:31.389
to be able to help clients
00:16:31.590 --> 00:16:32.009
make decisions.
00:16:32.029 --> 00:16:33.671
You got to go find all those details.
00:16:34.071 --> 00:16:35.211
And it is available.
00:16:35.471 --> 00:16:36.971
So on FSA.gov,
00:16:37.072 --> 00:16:39.792
behind your login for each individual,
00:16:40.432 --> 00:16:41.373
right underneath...
00:16:42.173 --> 00:16:44.696
the four bars that show that
00:16:44.716 --> 00:16:45.876
you have your 40 credits
00:16:46.337 --> 00:16:47.740
there's a line that just
00:16:47.759 --> 00:16:48.980
says want to see your full
00:16:49.041 --> 00:16:50.763
earnings statement here it
00:16:50.863 --> 00:16:53.046
is why yes I do I wanted to
00:16:53.086 --> 00:16:54.407
see it on my statement but
00:16:54.486 --> 00:16:55.869
okay I'll take nine more
00:16:55.928 --> 00:16:56.929
steps to get it it takes
00:16:56.970 --> 00:16:58.091
more time to find it than
00:16:58.131 --> 00:16:59.052
it does to complete to
00:16:59.113 --> 00:17:00.394
actually do the data entry
00:17:00.474 --> 00:17:02.456
if you find it print it
00:17:03.274 --> 00:17:03.494
Yeah.
00:17:03.673 --> 00:17:04.275
Yeah.
00:17:04.315 --> 00:17:05.796
Save it to a PDF and print it.
00:17:05.895 --> 00:17:06.476
Yeah.
00:17:06.635 --> 00:17:07.777
You may not find it again.
00:17:08.498 --> 00:17:08.718
Right.
00:17:08.738 --> 00:17:09.919
That's my experience anyway.
00:17:10.078 --> 00:17:10.459
Okay.
00:17:10.679 --> 00:17:11.038
All right.
00:17:11.078 --> 00:17:11.380
Sorry.
00:17:11.400 --> 00:17:13.240
Took us off track a little bit there.
00:17:13.260 --> 00:17:14.981
But, you know,
00:17:15.001 --> 00:17:16.923
I think this whole topic of
00:17:17.523 --> 00:17:20.025
windfall elimination provision, the,
00:17:20.905 --> 00:17:21.547
what's the other one?
00:17:21.606 --> 00:17:22.287
POP or something?
00:17:22.707 --> 00:17:24.387
GPO, government pension.
00:17:24.608 --> 00:17:25.148
That's what it is.
00:17:25.189 --> 00:17:26.210
Government pension upset.
00:17:27.009 --> 00:17:29.132
It's one of these things
00:17:29.172 --> 00:17:30.633
that people really need to
00:17:30.692 --> 00:17:32.993
have some awareness of,
00:17:33.035 --> 00:17:34.435
and it can be really challenging.
00:17:34.715 --> 00:17:37.057
Maybe just before we move on from this,
00:17:37.897 --> 00:17:39.159
how do those two differ,
00:17:39.278 --> 00:17:40.460
the government pension
00:17:40.579 --> 00:17:43.082
offset versus the windfall
00:17:43.102 --> 00:17:44.241
elimination provision?
00:17:44.281 --> 00:17:46.183
They're similar but different.
00:17:46.844 --> 00:17:47.084
Right.
00:17:47.744 --> 00:17:49.286
In a really meaningful way.
00:17:49.546 --> 00:17:51.366
So WEP applies to you
00:17:51.468 --> 00:17:53.128
personally if you have the
00:17:53.169 --> 00:17:56.191
state pension or the uncovered pension.
00:17:57.827 --> 00:18:00.671
GPO applies to you as a spouse.
00:18:01.612 --> 00:18:02.573
So here's the other big
00:18:02.613 --> 00:18:04.173
place where people get tripped up.
00:18:04.775 --> 00:18:06.155
So now we'll take this couple.
00:18:06.296 --> 00:18:08.659
He has a private sector job,
00:18:09.199 --> 00:18:11.801
has $4,000 a month for social security.
00:18:12.702 --> 00:18:14.403
And he knows the rule is his
00:18:14.443 --> 00:18:17.707
spouse gets half of his, $2,000,
00:18:17.707 --> 00:18:18.788
because she doesn't have
00:18:18.828 --> 00:18:19.788
any social security.
00:18:20.150 --> 00:18:21.510
She's a Massachusetts public
00:18:21.550 --> 00:18:22.071
school teacher.
00:18:23.290 --> 00:18:23.832
Well,
00:18:24.311 --> 00:18:26.114
I'm always the one to bear the bad news.
00:18:26.134 --> 00:18:27.214
I'm sure you guys are too.
00:18:27.654 --> 00:18:29.195
But yeah, she doesn't get $2,000.
00:18:29.256 --> 00:18:33.660
This is where GPO,
00:18:33.759 --> 00:18:35.882
the government pension offset applies.
00:18:36.623 --> 00:18:38.423
She's getting a government pension.
00:18:39.846 --> 00:18:41.267
So she didn't earn social security,
00:18:41.307 --> 00:18:41.967
but she's got $3,000 a month.
00:18:44.925 --> 00:18:48.126
His PIA is four thousand dollars a month.
00:18:48.166 --> 00:18:49.167
So he was thinking they were
00:18:49.188 --> 00:18:50.468
getting six grand in from
00:18:50.548 --> 00:18:52.229
Social Security plus her
00:18:52.308 --> 00:18:54.430
three thousand from the pension.
00:18:55.369 --> 00:18:58.330
Only she's not eligible for half of his.
00:18:59.250 --> 00:19:00.731
It starts out half of his.
00:19:01.211 --> 00:19:02.413
So two thousand dollars.
00:19:02.853 --> 00:19:04.413
And then it will be reduced.
00:19:04.452 --> 00:19:05.713
Her spousal benefit is
00:19:05.814 --> 00:19:07.994
reduced by two thirds of her pension.
00:19:09.021 --> 00:19:09.362
So by $2,000.
00:19:09.542 --> 00:19:10.403
Which wiped it out.
00:19:10.743 --> 00:19:12.265
Which wiped it out.
00:19:12.585 --> 00:19:12.945
Zero.
00:19:13.747 --> 00:19:15.407
So there's an important distinction.
00:19:15.488 --> 00:19:17.851
Although the windfall
00:19:17.871 --> 00:19:19.511
elimination provision won't
00:19:19.771 --> 00:19:21.653
entirely eliminate one's
00:19:21.673 --> 00:19:23.036
Social Security benefit,
00:19:23.056 --> 00:19:26.318
the government pension officer can.
00:19:26.338 --> 00:19:26.578
Yeah.
00:19:27.240 --> 00:19:27.339
Yeah.
00:19:28.003 --> 00:19:28.163
Yeah,
00:19:28.263 --> 00:19:30.726
especially for the career public
00:19:31.267 --> 00:19:31.987
sector workers.
00:19:32.007 --> 00:19:32.208
I mean,
00:19:32.448 --> 00:19:34.710
the pensions are quite good for
00:19:34.730 --> 00:19:35.170
those folks.
00:19:35.190 --> 00:19:35.589
I mean, again,
00:19:35.630 --> 00:19:37.132
if you've got a career person today,
00:19:37.192 --> 00:19:38.792
they've been in for 35 years,
00:19:39.913 --> 00:19:41.275
they've got a nice pension
00:19:41.335 --> 00:19:41.895
coming to them.
00:19:43.007 --> 00:19:45.609
So it's something to plan for.
00:19:45.630 --> 00:19:48.952
And if she's in this example,
00:19:49.173 --> 00:19:50.954
the one who has the public
00:19:50.994 --> 00:19:52.976
pension with the spousal benefit,
00:19:53.557 --> 00:19:55.439
if she's the remaining spouse,
00:19:55.479 --> 00:19:56.179
the survivor,
00:19:56.779 --> 00:20:00.604
GPO also applies to the survivor benefit.
00:20:01.839 --> 00:20:03.162
So also when you're planning,
00:20:03.182 --> 00:20:04.423
you're thinking, oh, okay,
00:20:04.442 --> 00:20:06.285
she's going to get screwed now, right?
00:20:06.305 --> 00:20:07.365
That's how people look at it.
00:20:07.707 --> 00:20:09.709
But at least she'll get his
00:20:09.709 --> 00:20:10.690
$4,000 if he dies first.
00:20:11.371 --> 00:20:12.211
No, she won't.
00:20:12.751 --> 00:20:14.693
She gets his $4,000 less
00:20:14.713 --> 00:20:16.876
two-thirds of her pension.
00:20:17.498 --> 00:20:18.558
And his pension may be
00:20:18.618 --> 00:20:20.881
reduced as well as a benefit.
00:20:21.569 --> 00:20:23.990
Yeah, so what happens in that scenario,
00:20:24.171 --> 00:20:25.570
she dies first in this scenario,
00:20:25.611 --> 00:20:26.931
but she included her spouse.
00:20:26.990 --> 00:20:28.092
And just for simplicity,
00:20:28.112 --> 00:20:28.892
we're going to make it 100%,
00:20:28.892 --> 00:20:30.511
so we don't have to do any
00:20:30.551 --> 00:20:31.571
complicated math here.
00:20:34.692 --> 00:20:37.554
So now he's receiving a public pension,
00:20:37.614 --> 00:20:37.834
right?
00:20:38.534 --> 00:20:39.413
He is.
00:20:39.713 --> 00:20:41.575
As the beneficiary survivor,
00:20:41.595 --> 00:20:43.755
he gets the 100% payout.
00:20:44.474 --> 00:20:45.895
So in that scenario,
00:20:46.135 --> 00:20:47.556
he'd be subject to the
00:20:47.615 --> 00:20:49.396
windfall elimination provision,
00:20:49.596 --> 00:20:50.977
or would that be the GPO?
00:20:51.829 --> 00:20:52.250
Neither.
00:20:52.911 --> 00:20:55.612
So in his case, if he's just an IBM worker,
00:20:55.852 --> 00:20:57.432
right, always in the private sector,
00:20:57.492 --> 00:20:58.772
he has his social security
00:20:58.913 --> 00:20:59.814
for a random month,
00:21:00.453 --> 00:21:01.894
he gets his $4,000 a month,
00:21:01.934 --> 00:21:03.435
then he is the recipient.
00:21:03.715 --> 00:21:05.195
So it has no bearing on his
00:21:05.256 --> 00:21:06.477
social security whatsoever.
00:21:06.957 --> 00:21:07.156
None.
00:21:07.176 --> 00:21:08.557
It has to be a public thing.
00:21:09.525 --> 00:21:10.986
Yeah, well,
00:21:11.185 --> 00:21:12.646
I'm thinking if this is the
00:21:12.727 --> 00:21:15.929
teacher who died first and
00:21:16.028 --> 00:21:17.549
now he's getting her $2,000
00:21:17.549 --> 00:21:18.351
in this scenario.
00:21:18.750 --> 00:21:18.931
Yep.
00:21:19.432 --> 00:21:21.452
He was getting $4,000 in Social Security.
00:21:22.053 --> 00:21:23.334
He's not affected by that
00:21:23.334 --> 00:21:25.174
$2,000 as an impact on his
00:21:25.214 --> 00:21:25.736
Social Security?
00:21:25.756 --> 00:21:27.916
No, because he was not the pensioner.
00:21:27.936 --> 00:21:28.718
Okay.
00:21:28.738 --> 00:21:29.718
All right.
00:21:30.159 --> 00:21:30.618
Interesting.
00:21:31.000 --> 00:21:32.541
But I will say what's hard
00:21:32.682 --> 00:21:33.742
when the teachers are
00:21:33.843 --> 00:21:36.305
choosing their pension options,
00:21:36.904 --> 00:21:39.886
it's very tempting to do a
00:21:39.987 --> 00:21:43.308
single life annuity on these pensions.
00:21:43.348 --> 00:21:44.470
So pay over one life.
00:21:44.650 --> 00:21:45.871
People very frequently.
00:21:46.151 --> 00:21:48.373
And I mean, just you can't do it.
00:21:48.932 --> 00:21:50.993
I mean, almost 99.9% of the time,
00:21:51.013 --> 00:21:51.755
that's a bad decision.
00:21:53.536 --> 00:21:55.057
Because you can't, you know,
00:21:55.538 --> 00:21:56.439
as I mentioned before,
00:21:56.818 --> 00:21:58.519
Dan always dies in my scenarios.
00:21:58.820 --> 00:22:00.862
Well, really, who knows?
00:22:01.323 --> 00:22:01.482
Right.
00:22:01.502 --> 00:22:02.963
I could be the one dropping dead tomorrow.
00:22:03.364 --> 00:22:03.565
Right.
00:22:03.585 --> 00:22:05.266
So and I have heard this
00:22:05.306 --> 00:22:06.727
from women in particular
00:22:06.767 --> 00:22:09.250
whose husbands were the lifetime teacher.
00:22:09.269 --> 00:22:11.371
It's like we thought he was
00:22:11.391 --> 00:22:12.412
going to live longer.
00:22:12.432 --> 00:22:14.653
It's like we hear this.
00:22:14.993 --> 00:22:16.256
Yeah.
00:22:16.455 --> 00:22:18.017
It's really it's tragic.
00:22:18.817 --> 00:22:19.137
Yeah.
00:22:19.357 --> 00:22:19.838
And yeah.
00:22:21.297 --> 00:22:22.596
I think it is one of these
00:22:22.636 --> 00:22:24.057
things where it seems to be
00:22:24.317 --> 00:22:26.138
more frequently with school
00:22:26.159 --> 00:22:27.699
teachers or public pension
00:22:27.778 --> 00:22:31.160
where they more frequently opt for that.
00:22:31.180 --> 00:22:32.080
Well, I have mine.
00:22:32.161 --> 00:22:35.481
He has his kind of mindset instead of,
00:22:35.561 --> 00:22:35.741
well,
00:22:35.842 --> 00:22:38.462
what happens when one of you isn't there?
00:22:38.522 --> 00:22:39.663
Your income just got cut in
00:22:39.702 --> 00:22:40.782
half potentially in that
00:22:40.843 --> 00:22:44.404
scenario or whatever.
00:22:44.744 --> 00:22:46.484
As you were saying earlier, Jeff,
00:22:46.505 --> 00:22:47.586
expenses don't necessarily
00:22:47.625 --> 00:22:48.506
get cut in half when
00:22:49.653 --> 00:22:51.032
when someone passes away,
00:22:51.093 --> 00:22:53.594
they may be diminished in, in some scale,
00:22:53.673 --> 00:22:54.773
but you know,
00:22:54.854 --> 00:22:56.815
it's one less meal to prepare.
00:22:56.855 --> 00:22:59.355
There's maybe not two cars, you know,
00:22:59.715 --> 00:23:00.135
but there's,
00:23:00.355 --> 00:23:02.016
there's still the same house
00:23:02.155 --> 00:23:05.477
and insurance and taxes and energy costs,
00:23:05.497 --> 00:23:05.896
et cetera.
00:23:05.936 --> 00:23:07.077
You know,
00:23:07.157 --> 00:23:08.018
there's a lot of things that
00:23:08.038 --> 00:23:08.577
don't change.
00:23:08.678 --> 00:23:10.137
Off topic a little bit, but related.
00:23:10.218 --> 00:23:12.239
Sometimes everybody's
00:23:12.259 --> 00:23:13.138
different and they need to
00:23:13.179 --> 00:23:14.259
look at this individually,
00:23:14.640 --> 00:23:16.259
but sometimes life insurance can,
00:23:17.346 --> 00:23:17.946
Play into this.
00:23:18.067 --> 00:23:18.949
Yeah, that's a good point.
00:23:18.969 --> 00:23:20.271
Yeah, that's a good point.
00:23:20.311 --> 00:23:21.173
Permanent life insurance.
00:23:21.394 --> 00:23:23.979
As a tool to mitigate these risks.
00:23:24.019 --> 00:23:25.080
To allow them to take the
00:23:25.121 --> 00:23:25.962
full pension amount.
00:23:26.624 --> 00:23:28.267
But that's I think your
00:23:28.326 --> 00:23:29.549
comment is a really important one.
00:23:30.160 --> 00:23:30.820
it really has to be a
00:23:30.881 --> 00:23:31.820
permanent insurance
00:23:31.861 --> 00:23:32.862
solution and the
00:23:32.922 --> 00:23:34.663
calculation of how you come up with that.
00:23:35.044 --> 00:23:36.164
A lot of times people don't
00:23:36.224 --> 00:23:38.066
do it in a way that's a more nuanced way.
00:23:38.807 --> 00:23:40.248
They just say, well, what can I afford?
00:23:40.647 --> 00:23:43.029
And I'll, I'll, you know, right.
00:23:43.109 --> 00:23:43.750
What's the amount.
00:23:43.931 --> 00:23:44.391
Yeah.
00:23:44.611 --> 00:23:46.172
And a lot of times it should
00:23:46.211 --> 00:23:48.834
be maybe more nuanced to say, well,
00:23:49.555 --> 00:23:51.556
in effect, what if I had to buy a pension,
00:23:51.997 --> 00:23:53.857
buy an annuity, an income,
00:23:53.938 --> 00:23:55.819
how much money immediately, right.
00:23:55.839 --> 00:23:57.540
You know, they died right away.
00:23:57.601 --> 00:23:57.740
Well,
00:23:57.780 --> 00:23:59.722
what would that require for a benefit
00:23:59.762 --> 00:23:59.962
amount?
00:24:00.406 --> 00:24:01.386
Now you don't expect that to
00:24:01.406 --> 00:24:02.347
be the way it happens.
00:24:02.367 --> 00:24:03.788
A million dollars with 30
00:24:03.788 --> 00:24:04.909
years left to live is
00:24:05.128 --> 00:24:06.729
different than with five years left.
00:24:07.209 --> 00:24:07.388
Right.
00:24:07.469 --> 00:24:08.430
Absolutely.
00:24:09.069 --> 00:24:09.950
And even though that may not
00:24:09.990 --> 00:24:11.270
be the way one chooses to
00:24:11.431 --> 00:24:13.672
execute the use of those funds, you know,
00:24:13.692 --> 00:24:14.751
to buy an annuity or something.
00:24:14.771 --> 00:24:14.991
Sure.
00:24:15.211 --> 00:24:16.573
But that's a fair way to
00:24:16.633 --> 00:24:18.432
calculate how much do I
00:24:18.792 --> 00:24:21.213
need to replicate an income stream?
00:24:21.513 --> 00:24:21.713
Right.
00:24:21.753 --> 00:24:22.315
You know what I mean?
00:24:22.355 --> 00:24:22.914
That kind of thing.
00:24:23.934 --> 00:24:24.835
And the other thing, you know,
00:24:24.855 --> 00:24:25.895
a little bit tongue in cheek,
00:24:25.976 --> 00:24:28.176
but I always tell Dan when he dies,
00:24:28.196 --> 00:24:29.116
I'm spending more.
00:24:30.133 --> 00:24:30.554
Yeah.
00:24:30.574 --> 00:24:32.756
So you might need a little more.
00:24:32.875 --> 00:24:33.156
Yeah.
00:24:33.777 --> 00:24:35.798
And not to buy fancy things or whatnot,
00:24:35.838 --> 00:24:37.461
but, you know, I'll go out, you know,
00:24:37.500 --> 00:24:38.721
with friends, you know,
00:24:38.741 --> 00:24:41.765
you need to build social life.
00:24:41.845 --> 00:24:42.645
I may, you know,
00:24:42.665 --> 00:24:43.907
go out to Minnesota to see
00:24:43.948 --> 00:24:45.528
my kids way more often.
00:24:45.849 --> 00:24:47.651
There are things that I
00:24:47.692 --> 00:24:49.713
don't want to have anything curtailed.
00:24:50.907 --> 00:24:52.648
Just because Dan's gone.
00:24:52.709 --> 00:24:54.229
So we joke about it.
00:24:54.288 --> 00:24:55.288
It's like, oh, my God,
00:24:55.308 --> 00:24:56.069
you're going to blow
00:24:56.089 --> 00:24:56.950
through all our money.
00:24:57.029 --> 00:24:58.930
It's like, you're not going to be here.
00:24:59.671 --> 00:25:01.990
Won't be your problem.
00:25:03.271 --> 00:25:03.971
It's not always that.
00:25:04.031 --> 00:25:05.092
Does he give you a hard time
00:25:05.132 --> 00:25:05.873
about any of this stuff?
00:25:05.893 --> 00:25:08.133
Like when I am single, you know,
00:25:08.173 --> 00:25:08.894
that kind of thing?
00:25:08.913 --> 00:25:09.534
None of that?
00:25:10.413 --> 00:25:12.755
No, because Daniel can't even imagine.
00:25:13.095 --> 00:25:13.234
Oh,
00:25:13.295 --> 00:25:15.576
he'd be heartbroken and just he'd die
00:25:15.655 --> 00:25:16.016
anyway.
00:25:16.036 --> 00:25:16.496
Yeah.
00:25:17.332 --> 00:25:18.232
I don't think he would die,
00:25:18.292 --> 00:25:19.433
and I've already told our kids,
00:25:19.773 --> 00:25:21.654
you get dad if I die first.
00:25:21.674 --> 00:25:24.278
So, you know, that's the plan.
00:25:24.417 --> 00:25:25.739
He sure knows how to answer it right,
00:25:25.798 --> 00:25:26.378
I will say.
00:25:26.398 --> 00:25:27.019
That's pretty good.
00:25:27.200 --> 00:25:27.619
Good answer.
00:25:29.080 --> 00:25:30.281
All right,
00:25:30.342 --> 00:25:32.423
so let's go back to some of the
00:25:32.564 --> 00:25:33.605
other topics.
00:25:33.984 --> 00:25:35.145
What else should we talk about?
00:25:35.165 --> 00:25:35.886
Let's talk about divorce.
00:25:36.527 --> 00:25:37.367
Yeah, okay, sure.
00:25:38.836 --> 00:25:38.977
Yeah,
00:25:39.017 --> 00:25:40.958
divorce is always interesting because
00:25:40.998 --> 00:25:43.057
we have two parties who
00:25:43.258 --> 00:25:46.778
are- That's true too, yeah.
00:25:46.818 --> 00:25:47.459
That's true, yeah.
00:25:47.499 --> 00:25:49.119
Yeah, let's say emotional.
00:25:49.680 --> 00:25:51.500
The divorce could have been 20 years ago,
00:25:51.619 --> 00:25:54.361
but there is still some baggage there.
00:25:54.941 --> 00:25:55.701
So the rules,
00:25:55.901 --> 00:25:57.821
the rules are straightforward.
00:25:58.082 --> 00:25:59.021
You had to have been married
00:25:59.061 --> 00:26:00.741
to your ex for 10 years or longer.
00:26:01.182 --> 00:26:02.303
That's the first gate.
00:26:02.663 --> 00:26:03.563
If you were married for nine
00:26:03.583 --> 00:26:05.743
years and change, you don't qualify.
00:26:05.763 --> 00:26:06.923
But none of these-
00:26:08.202 --> 00:26:09.242
Last minute marriages.
00:26:09.282 --> 00:26:09.463
Like,
00:26:09.983 --> 00:26:11.104
I'm going to get married until I get
00:26:11.144 --> 00:26:11.644
half a year.
00:26:12.664 --> 00:26:13.944
Well, I'm going to come back to that.
00:26:14.144 --> 00:26:14.445
Okay.
00:26:15.385 --> 00:26:16.506
Okay.
00:26:16.645 --> 00:26:18.007
This is divorce, not marriage.
00:26:18.027 --> 00:26:18.366
Divorce.
00:26:18.527 --> 00:26:18.767
Right.
00:26:19.067 --> 00:26:19.647
For divorce.
00:26:19.688 --> 00:26:21.689
So it's 10 years or longer.
00:26:21.709 --> 00:26:24.589
You each are at least age 62.
00:26:26.671 --> 00:26:27.790
You have not remarried.
00:26:27.830 --> 00:26:29.491
We don't care what your ex has done.
00:26:29.832 --> 00:26:30.152
Right there.
00:26:30.172 --> 00:26:31.972
That's always a big... But he remarried.
00:26:32.292 --> 00:26:33.192
We don't care what he did.
00:26:33.794 --> 00:26:35.753
So you have not remarried.
00:26:36.755 --> 00:26:36.934
And...
00:26:38.492 --> 00:26:39.496
What's number four?
00:26:39.516 --> 00:26:42.844
And it has to yield a larger
00:26:42.923 --> 00:26:44.086
amount than your own.
00:26:44.428 --> 00:26:44.749
Sure.
00:26:44.989 --> 00:26:45.230
Right.
00:26:45.846 --> 00:26:47.006
And the divorce had to have
00:26:47.547 --> 00:26:48.426
been two years or longer.
00:26:49.126 --> 00:26:51.508
So what happens here is
00:26:52.127 --> 00:26:54.088
usually the scenario is the
00:26:54.249 --> 00:26:57.170
ex-wife has no idea that
00:26:57.230 --> 00:26:59.030
she's even eligible for
00:26:59.510 --> 00:27:00.911
Social Security other than
00:27:01.070 --> 00:27:01.951
whatever she's had.
00:27:02.311 --> 00:27:04.132
Now, she's getting $3,000 a month.
00:27:04.432 --> 00:27:05.813
Yay, she had a great career.
00:27:05.913 --> 00:27:06.833
She's doing wonderfully.
00:27:07.653 --> 00:27:09.794
But if she were the at-home mom,
00:27:10.673 --> 00:27:11.615
she doesn't know she can
00:27:13.580 --> 00:27:16.186
qualify as an ex-spouse for
00:27:16.227 --> 00:27:17.710
an ex-spousal top up.
00:27:18.230 --> 00:27:18.751
Yeah.
00:27:19.333 --> 00:27:20.154
So what happens is she'll
00:27:20.174 --> 00:27:21.076
get her own benefit.
00:27:21.096 --> 00:27:22.500
We'll say it's a thousand dollars a month.
00:27:23.338 --> 00:27:26.101
But if he's getting $4,000 a
00:27:26.240 --> 00:27:27.721
month because he was the higher earner,
00:27:28.262 --> 00:27:30.223
she's entitled to his
00:27:30.584 --> 00:27:33.226
ex-spousal top up as if she
00:27:33.266 --> 00:27:34.948
were still married to the same person.
00:27:35.688 --> 00:27:37.609
So she'll get an extra $1,000 a month.
00:27:38.049 --> 00:27:40.392
And let me tell you, that is a huge win,
00:27:41.152 --> 00:27:41.333
right?
00:27:41.373 --> 00:27:42.413
Because she thought she only
00:27:42.452 --> 00:27:42.993
had $1,000 as her foundation.
00:27:43.013 --> 00:27:43.413
Now she has $2,000.
00:27:43.453 --> 00:27:44.595
Now, Marcia, talk about the timing.
00:27:49.849 --> 00:27:50.990
when this is relevant?
00:27:51.250 --> 00:27:53.011
What if she retires sooner
00:27:53.051 --> 00:27:54.532
and wants to have her
00:27:54.553 --> 00:27:56.314
Social Security benefits start sooner?
00:27:56.855 --> 00:27:58.276
What if he retires later?
00:27:58.415 --> 00:28:00.356
So he's not collecting something.
00:28:00.396 --> 00:28:00.676
Yeah,
00:28:00.856 --> 00:28:03.338
and is not collecting it until later.
00:28:04.140 --> 00:28:05.780
How does that play into some
00:28:05.800 --> 00:28:06.901
of these considerations?
00:28:07.082 --> 00:28:07.162
And
00:28:07.821 --> 00:28:09.041
You made the point in other
00:28:09.261 --> 00:28:11.323
conversations that the
00:28:11.563 --> 00:28:13.363
ex-spouse doesn't need to
00:28:13.403 --> 00:28:15.023
have any involvement to
00:28:15.124 --> 00:28:16.044
know anything about.
00:28:16.064 --> 00:28:17.003
It's not coming off their chest.
00:28:17.044 --> 00:28:18.084
It's not something that
00:28:18.163 --> 00:28:20.664
they're involved in in any way.
00:28:20.805 --> 00:28:21.904
Do they even get notified?
00:28:22.444 --> 00:28:23.545
No, they don't.
00:28:23.924 --> 00:28:26.066
This is strictly private
00:28:26.145 --> 00:28:28.865
between each individual and
00:28:28.885 --> 00:28:30.287
the Social Security Administration.
00:28:30.626 --> 00:28:31.086
You're right.
00:28:31.106 --> 00:28:31.987
I think that's important for
00:28:32.027 --> 00:28:32.606
people to know.
00:28:32.626 --> 00:28:35.028
Sometimes it's important to people.
00:28:35.048 --> 00:28:36.288
Although they might send an email.
00:28:36.989 --> 00:28:39.530
Yeah, I mean, unfortunately,
00:28:39.550 --> 00:28:42.493
these divorces can be very, very nasty.
00:28:42.513 --> 00:28:44.695
And then all of a sudden, 10 years later,
00:28:44.715 --> 00:28:46.637
your ex-husband is showing up,
00:28:46.698 --> 00:28:47.739
knocking on the door going, hey,
00:28:47.778 --> 00:28:49.180
I want half your Social Security.
00:28:49.880 --> 00:28:50.901
That never happens.
00:28:51.602 --> 00:28:53.103
This is strictly private.
00:28:53.663 --> 00:28:55.125
But what's interesting, Chris,
00:28:55.164 --> 00:28:56.787
as far as timing goes.
00:28:57.346 --> 00:28:59.548
Yeah, that can have some consequence.
00:28:59.608 --> 00:28:59.949
Again,
00:28:59.989 --> 00:29:02.010
it makes no difference what your ex
00:29:02.070 --> 00:29:02.511
is doing.
00:29:03.576 --> 00:29:04.797
Absolutely none.
00:29:05.217 --> 00:29:06.719
The only rule is the divorce
00:29:06.759 --> 00:29:08.920
had to be two years ago or longer.
00:29:08.940 --> 00:29:09.980
Okay.
00:29:10.020 --> 00:29:11.021
So you do have this one
00:29:11.102 --> 00:29:12.603
two-year window you have to wait.
00:29:12.884 --> 00:29:14.184
Whether they've started
00:29:14.265 --> 00:29:15.705
receiving their benefits,
00:29:16.487 --> 00:29:17.928
whether they waited until
00:29:17.968 --> 00:29:20.349
they were 70 to get that extra,
00:29:21.069 --> 00:29:23.873
it has no bearing on the ex-spouse.
00:29:25.554 --> 00:29:27.556
Based on their full retirement benefit?
00:29:27.996 --> 00:29:28.957
Nope.
00:29:29.616 --> 00:29:30.597
Use that date,
00:29:31.259 --> 00:29:32.019
what they would be getting
00:29:32.138 --> 00:29:33.000
if they were collecting?
00:29:33.803 --> 00:29:35.884
Nope, just PIA.
00:29:36.805 --> 00:29:37.464
And because all these
00:29:37.525 --> 00:29:39.567
benefits are calculated benefits.
00:29:39.626 --> 00:29:40.988
So let's just say Dan and I
00:29:41.028 --> 00:29:43.009
are divorced and I'm the lower earner.
00:29:44.349 --> 00:29:47.511
In order for me to get half of his PIA,
00:29:48.573 --> 00:29:50.294
I have to be a much lower earner.
00:29:51.193 --> 00:29:53.736
And the other rules, 10 years,
00:29:53.796 --> 00:29:55.636
divorce was five years ago.
00:29:55.958 --> 00:29:57.038
So if he started his at 62
00:29:57.038 --> 00:29:58.219
with a 30% discount or whatever it is.
00:29:58.239 --> 00:29:58.960
That's exactly it.
00:30:03.396 --> 00:30:03.978
Don't care.
00:30:04.637 --> 00:30:05.838
And then you're going to
00:30:05.878 --> 00:30:07.901
start at a full retirement age.
00:30:07.921 --> 00:30:09.422
Because that's the key.
00:30:09.461 --> 00:30:11.644
In order for me to get half of his PIA,
00:30:12.243 --> 00:30:14.306
I have to be at my full retirement age.
00:30:15.287 --> 00:30:16.988
So let's say I did wait that long.
00:30:17.028 --> 00:30:17.348
And again,
00:30:17.368 --> 00:30:18.549
we're going to use simple numbers.
00:30:18.730 --> 00:30:21.211
His benefit was $4,000, his PIA.
00:30:21.872 --> 00:30:23.713
So I'm entitled to $2,000,
00:30:23.713 --> 00:30:26.336
assuming I've met all the other rules.
00:30:26.935 --> 00:30:29.097
Now, that's Dan's PIA.
00:30:29.317 --> 00:30:30.538
If he claimed early...
00:30:31.440 --> 00:30:33.461
And he's only getting $3,000 a month.
00:30:33.861 --> 00:30:35.142
First of all, I will never know.
00:30:35.162 --> 00:30:36.662
I don't care.
00:30:37.403 --> 00:30:38.823
Social Security doesn't care.
00:30:38.843 --> 00:30:41.324
So it's still based on that
00:30:41.324 --> 00:30:43.765
$4,000 at full retirement calculation.
00:30:43.785 --> 00:30:45.226
Everything is about that PIA,
00:30:45.266 --> 00:30:46.946
that primary insurance amount.
00:30:47.007 --> 00:30:47.606
And that's, again,
00:30:47.626 --> 00:30:50.448
that calculated benefit at
00:30:50.528 --> 00:30:52.028
your own full retirement age.
00:30:53.869 --> 00:30:54.069
Now,
00:30:54.369 --> 00:30:56.090
where does it come out really to play?
00:30:56.730 --> 00:30:57.330
Two pieces.
00:30:58.070 --> 00:31:01.392
One, when Dan dies in this scenario, I,
00:31:01.451 --> 00:31:03.932
as the ex-spouse, qualifying ex-spouse,
00:31:04.373 --> 00:31:06.192
still get to step into his shoes.
00:31:06.973 --> 00:31:08.433
So if he claimed early and
00:31:08.473 --> 00:31:10.634
is only getting $3,000 a month,
00:31:11.095 --> 00:31:13.494
that's what I will get as a
00:31:14.635 --> 00:31:16.336
widow of an ex-spouse.
00:31:17.385 --> 00:31:20.371
Now, if Dan, unthinkable, I'm sure,
00:31:20.750 --> 00:31:21.772
but if he remarried,
00:31:22.513 --> 00:31:23.336
would that still be
00:31:23.375 --> 00:31:24.597
applicable or would that change?
00:31:25.479 --> 00:31:28.020
For me, it's still applicable.
00:31:28.221 --> 00:31:30.123
All the possibilities, right?
00:31:30.163 --> 00:31:30.343
No,
00:31:30.363 --> 00:31:31.923
but this is what's important because
00:31:33.125 --> 00:31:34.445
widows and widowers don't
00:31:34.546 --> 00:31:35.948
know to call Social
00:31:35.988 --> 00:31:37.189
Security after they learn
00:31:37.229 --> 00:31:39.509
of the death of their ex to just say,
00:31:39.549 --> 00:31:40.912
look, my ex died.
00:31:41.112 --> 00:31:44.594
I'm wondering, would I get a bump up?
00:31:44.694 --> 00:31:46.056
Do I get a different amount
00:31:46.115 --> 00:31:47.616
as a surviving ex-spouse?
00:31:48.557 --> 00:31:50.179
And if the answer is yes,
00:31:50.459 --> 00:31:52.161
you have earned that or you
00:31:52.201 --> 00:31:53.682
are entitled to that money.
00:31:54.326 --> 00:31:58.067
So in the case of the new spouse, is it?
00:31:58.846 --> 00:31:59.527
So it's a double,
00:31:59.606 --> 00:32:01.146
double dip there a little bit.
00:32:01.666 --> 00:32:02.326
Yes, it is.
00:32:02.887 --> 00:32:04.728
But again, it's been running out of money.
00:32:04.807 --> 00:32:06.347
Yeah.
00:32:06.407 --> 00:32:07.107
Yeah.
00:32:07.147 --> 00:32:08.008
Reform ideas.
00:32:08.848 --> 00:32:09.088
Yeah.
00:32:09.949 --> 00:32:10.269
Right.
00:32:11.148 --> 00:32:13.808
So you have the X and multiple X's,
00:32:13.969 --> 00:32:14.190
you know,
00:32:14.210 --> 00:32:17.009
if Dan had multiple X's all qualifying,
00:32:17.049 --> 00:32:19.329
if he married and remarried three times,
00:32:20.330 --> 00:32:22.431
then all three of those women would,
00:32:23.598 --> 00:32:26.301
are entitled to ex-spousal benefits.
00:32:27.042 --> 00:32:29.224
And both half of his while
00:32:29.586 --> 00:32:30.386
everyone's alive,
00:32:30.567 --> 00:32:31.867
and then they step into his
00:32:31.887 --> 00:32:34.010
shoes when- They shouldn't be penalized.
00:32:34.111 --> 00:32:35.352
I mean, that's- Yeah, that's, yeah,
00:32:35.432 --> 00:32:35.992
exactly.
00:32:36.032 --> 00:32:36.993
That's not their, yeah.
00:32:37.213 --> 00:32:37.334
Right.
00:32:37.374 --> 00:32:37.694
Good point.
00:32:38.999 --> 00:32:39.400
And again,
00:32:39.579 --> 00:32:41.059
the actuaries have come up with
00:32:41.099 --> 00:32:42.161
all these calculations.
00:32:42.240 --> 00:32:44.942
So divorce was not unknown in the 30s.
00:32:45.863 --> 00:32:48.223
So this is built into the
00:32:48.284 --> 00:32:50.164
overall calculations to
00:32:50.224 --> 00:32:52.205
make sure that the program
00:32:52.246 --> 00:32:54.907
is sustainable and that
00:32:54.948 --> 00:32:57.148
we're not leaving widows or
00:32:57.409 --> 00:32:59.750
women in particular out on
00:32:59.789 --> 00:33:02.310
the street with no foundation.
00:33:02.330 --> 00:33:03.571
Yep.
00:33:06.115 --> 00:33:08.537
What I find interesting today,
00:33:08.557 --> 00:33:10.298
the law is that you needed
00:33:10.318 --> 00:33:11.759
to be married 10 years or longer.
00:33:12.381 --> 00:33:16.344
Originally, to be a qualifying ex-spouse,
00:33:16.503 --> 00:33:18.046
you had to be married 20 years.
00:33:18.906 --> 00:33:19.207
Wow.
00:33:20.288 --> 00:33:21.588
So that can be very
00:33:21.648 --> 00:33:23.590
difficult if you are in a
00:33:23.830 --> 00:33:24.832
difficult marriage.
00:33:25.551 --> 00:33:28.855
So I'm glad to see that that changed.
00:33:29.096 --> 00:33:29.836
I want to say in the 70s.
00:33:32.030 --> 00:33:35.335
So there's no retroactivity
00:33:35.375 --> 00:33:36.336
or anything where someone
00:33:37.537 --> 00:33:38.637
has to worry about that,
00:33:39.098 --> 00:33:40.680
that they fall into that
00:33:40.720 --> 00:33:41.560
category or something.
00:33:41.821 --> 00:33:43.804
It's like rules change for everybody.
00:33:44.332 --> 00:33:45.153
Yes, correct.
00:33:45.512 --> 00:33:46.773
And now men.
00:33:47.354 --> 00:33:49.154
So now let's flip the switch situation.
00:33:49.194 --> 00:33:49.335
Right.
00:33:49.355 --> 00:33:50.415
And let's say I'm the higher
00:33:50.496 --> 00:33:52.436
earner and Dan and I are divorced.
00:33:52.557 --> 00:33:55.459
Dan is entitled to half of my PIA.
00:33:56.460 --> 00:33:58.300
Also gender neutral for same
00:33:58.340 --> 00:33:59.442
sex married couples.
00:33:59.942 --> 00:34:00.823
They get a divorce.
00:34:01.242 --> 00:34:01.624
Same thing.
00:34:01.663 --> 00:34:03.184
If you meet those rules,
00:34:03.244 --> 00:34:05.125
those I come the gating rules,
00:34:05.665 --> 00:34:07.086
mainly 10 years or longer
00:34:07.126 --> 00:34:09.748
that you were married, you are entitled.
00:34:10.028 --> 00:34:12.251
You built an economic household together,
00:34:12.510 --> 00:34:13.311
however you did it.
00:34:14.012 --> 00:34:14.192
Right.
00:34:15.134 --> 00:34:15.795
Yeah, good points.
00:34:15.934 --> 00:34:16.914
Yeah, very good points.
00:34:17.335 --> 00:34:20.038
So I had mentioned the deathbed marriage,
00:34:20.177 --> 00:34:20.478
right?
00:34:21.139 --> 00:34:22.000
Oh, yes, yes.
00:34:22.559 --> 00:34:22.960
Good point.
00:34:22.980 --> 00:34:25.262
So the deathbed marriage is interesting.
00:34:25.442 --> 00:34:28.804
So you have to be married
00:34:28.945 --> 00:34:32.208
for a year to be eligible
00:34:32.487 --> 00:34:34.168
for survivor benefits.
00:34:34.188 --> 00:34:36.331
Okay.
00:34:36.351 --> 00:34:38.373
So if you had this marriage
00:34:38.472 --> 00:34:40.894
and then he died three weeks later,
00:34:41.494 --> 00:34:43.597
that wasn't long enough to establish,
00:34:43.617 --> 00:34:43.817
you know...
00:34:45.527 --> 00:34:47.047
the marriage however if he
00:34:47.088 --> 00:34:48.807
dies in a military action
00:34:49.208 --> 00:34:52.688
or an unknowable accident
00:34:53.530 --> 00:34:56.291
then she would be entitled
00:34:56.371 --> 00:34:57.731
at that point even with a
00:34:57.771 --> 00:35:00.271
short marriage an unknown
00:35:00.331 --> 00:35:02.472
car accident would be an
00:35:02.532 --> 00:35:03.532
example of an unknowable
00:35:03.552 --> 00:35:04.472
accident right so they're
00:35:04.492 --> 00:35:05.693
just trying to avoid the
00:35:05.733 --> 00:35:07.014
death playing games with it
00:35:07.193 --> 00:35:09.054
yes exactly exactly
00:35:12.945 --> 00:35:13.126
Okay.
00:35:13.146 --> 00:35:14.827
We see oftentimes people
00:35:15.387 --> 00:35:19.568
later in life decide, should we remarry?
00:35:19.628 --> 00:35:21.750
Should we not?
00:35:21.769 --> 00:35:23.931
That kind of mindset.
00:35:24.030 --> 00:35:25.672
There's all the long-term
00:35:25.711 --> 00:35:27.733
care considerations of
00:35:27.813 --> 00:35:29.853
intermingling their finances or not.
00:35:29.873 --> 00:35:31.414
That was my mom.
00:35:31.554 --> 00:35:33.355
She said, we're not going to get married.
00:35:33.394 --> 00:35:34.376
We don't want to screw this up.
00:35:34.675 --> 00:35:36.797
But this may be one of those variables.
00:35:36.817 --> 00:35:38.137
That's what she was talking about,
00:35:38.197 --> 00:35:38.757
finances.
00:35:38.818 --> 00:35:39.097
Yeah,
00:35:39.217 --> 00:35:40.739
and then Social Security could be one
00:35:40.759 --> 00:35:43.480
of those variables that factors into that,
00:35:44.380 --> 00:35:44.681
you know,
00:35:44.760 --> 00:35:47.842
the financial wherewithal of the
00:35:47.902 --> 00:35:48.503
survivor.
00:35:48.523 --> 00:35:51.945
Is there a scenario that an
00:35:52.945 --> 00:35:54.146
older couple get married
00:35:54.226 --> 00:35:55.565
and it's detrimental to
00:35:55.606 --> 00:35:56.527
their Social Security?
00:35:58.840 --> 00:36:01.402
No, I'm just saying whether to marry.
00:36:01.442 --> 00:36:02.862
Sometimes they refrain from
00:36:02.902 --> 00:36:04.083
that because of a financial
00:36:04.143 --> 00:36:05.063
consideration.
00:36:05.844 --> 00:36:06.925
This could be another
00:36:07.025 --> 00:36:08.346
financial consideration
00:36:08.985 --> 00:36:10.766
that could be a virtue to
00:36:10.827 --> 00:36:13.128
have that survivor benefit.
00:36:13.248 --> 00:36:14.028
You know what I mean?
00:36:14.208 --> 00:36:16.231
Yeah, that's where I was going with that.
00:36:16.251 --> 00:36:16.610
Yeah,
00:36:16.871 --> 00:36:19.652
and the only age marker to think
00:36:19.713 --> 00:36:21.793
about is age 60.
00:36:21.793 --> 00:36:23.255
So if you're already a widow...
00:36:24.467 --> 00:36:28.291
and you remarry before age 60,
00:36:28.291 --> 00:36:29.713
you cannot continue to
00:36:29.773 --> 00:36:31.293
receive survivor benefits
00:36:31.514 --> 00:36:32.474
because now you're married
00:36:32.534 --> 00:36:33.976
to a living person.
00:36:34.476 --> 00:36:35.838
Yes.
00:36:35.858 --> 00:36:36.778
So that's one.
00:36:36.858 --> 00:36:38.500
But for the older couples,
00:36:39.561 --> 00:36:41.041
there's the romance side of
00:36:41.862 --> 00:36:42.804
life and there's the
00:36:42.884 --> 00:36:44.045
financial side of life.
00:36:44.284 --> 00:36:44.605
Right.
00:36:45.126 --> 00:36:45.286
And-
00:36:46.137 --> 00:36:48.179
they're equally important.
00:36:48.659 --> 00:36:50.300
And the financial side is not romantic,
00:36:50.460 --> 00:36:50.619
right?
00:36:50.699 --> 00:36:52.400
But it's super important to look at.
00:36:52.721 --> 00:36:54.001
And especially if you have
00:36:54.320 --> 00:36:57.342
children and grandchildren and, you know,
00:36:57.362 --> 00:36:58.483
then you need a prenup.
00:36:58.963 --> 00:37:00.362
And the estate planning and
00:37:00.402 --> 00:37:00.923
all the documents.
00:37:00.963 --> 00:37:01.384
Yes.
00:37:01.603 --> 00:37:03.403
And if you're in a common law state,
00:37:03.585 --> 00:37:04.824
you know, once you get married,
00:37:05.644 --> 00:37:06.286
common law.
00:37:07.166 --> 00:37:07.445
Sorry,
00:37:07.545 --> 00:37:09.186
is that the right phrase I'm looking for?
00:37:09.246 --> 00:37:10.327
The 50-50 states.
00:37:11.628 --> 00:37:12.788
Community property.
00:37:12.807 --> 00:37:13.447
Thank you.
00:37:13.847 --> 00:37:15.188
Community property state.
00:37:16.184 --> 00:37:16.423
You know,
00:37:16.483 --> 00:37:17.706
there are lots of more
00:37:17.766 --> 00:37:19.447
complications on the one hand,
00:37:19.507 --> 00:37:20.849
and then it's simpler on the other.
00:37:21.010 --> 00:37:21.851
But yeah,
00:37:21.891 --> 00:37:24.534
the second marriages can be very
00:37:24.594 --> 00:37:26.335
complicated and need to be
00:37:26.536 --> 00:37:27.436
really thought through
00:37:28.438 --> 00:37:30.061
financially as well as
00:37:30.981 --> 00:37:32.804
family and implications.
00:37:32.884 --> 00:37:33.103
Yeah.
00:37:33.644 --> 00:37:33.804
Yeah.
00:37:34.994 --> 00:37:36.016
We mentioned on a prior
00:37:36.056 --> 00:37:38.639
episode about your
00:37:38.699 --> 00:37:42.603
publications and your books and so forth,
00:37:42.643 --> 00:37:44.563
but I wanted to just take a moment to say,
00:37:45.244 --> 00:37:46.206
how should people be
00:37:46.666 --> 00:37:47.887
following all the great
00:37:47.947 --> 00:37:50.010
insights that you share routinely,
00:37:50.230 --> 00:37:50.610
Marcia?
00:37:50.630 --> 00:37:51.431
What's the best way for
00:37:51.471 --> 00:37:53.333
people to keep track of all
00:37:53.353 --> 00:37:54.134
that you're putting out?
00:37:54.969 --> 00:37:56.150
Well, thank you for asking.
00:37:56.570 --> 00:37:58.630
The best place is my blog,
00:37:58.650 --> 00:37:59.510
and it's called
00:37:59.590 --> 00:38:01.650
boomerretirementbriefs.com.
00:38:01.690 --> 00:38:04.532
So I have lots of fun
00:38:05.012 --> 00:38:06.012
articles about what boomers
00:38:06.052 --> 00:38:07.072
are doing for retirement,
00:38:07.112 --> 00:38:08.413
as well as some technical stuff.
00:38:09.032 --> 00:38:10.713
Or my business website,
00:38:10.793 --> 00:38:13.994
which is mantellretirementconsulting.com.
00:38:14.554 --> 00:38:15.614
And that's where I have a
00:38:15.974 --> 00:38:17.554
media library of all the
00:38:17.675 --> 00:38:18.695
articles I've written or
00:38:18.715 --> 00:38:19.974
all the media interviews
00:38:20.054 --> 00:38:21.675
that have taken place and
00:38:21.715 --> 00:38:23.135
all the podcasts like this one.
00:38:24.012 --> 00:38:24.452
Excellent.
00:38:24.612 --> 00:38:25.853
Well, I'm glad we'll be there.
00:38:27.054 --> 00:38:28.954
So definitely check that out.
00:38:29.436 --> 00:38:30.536
Get all kinds of great
00:38:30.576 --> 00:38:31.797
information from Marcia.
00:38:31.836 --> 00:38:33.757
She's just a wealth of good information,
00:38:33.818 --> 00:38:34.938
as you can tell from our
00:38:34.998 --> 00:38:37.199
conversations that we've had.
00:38:37.679 --> 00:38:38.039
Marcia,
00:38:38.119 --> 00:38:39.579
thank you for making the time to be
00:38:39.639 --> 00:38:39.920
with us.
00:38:39.980 --> 00:38:41.101
More time than we planned.
00:38:41.920 --> 00:38:44.641
And so much to learn,
00:38:44.722 --> 00:38:45.563
so much to talk about.
00:38:45.583 --> 00:38:49.704
And anything else you want
00:38:49.744 --> 00:38:50.824
to share in terms of
00:38:50.905 --> 00:38:52.186
contact or anything else?
00:38:53.699 --> 00:38:55.119
No, just one bit of advice,
00:38:55.239 --> 00:38:56.481
which is please, please,
00:38:56.521 --> 00:38:58.101
please set up your My
00:38:58.161 --> 00:39:00.224
Social Security online account.
00:39:00.684 --> 00:39:02.005
Get your statement and your
00:39:02.065 --> 00:39:02.905
earnings history.
00:39:03.525 --> 00:39:04.246
Good counsel.
00:39:05.146 --> 00:39:05.867
Jeff, thank you.
00:39:06.228 --> 00:39:07.268
Marcia, thank you.
00:39:07.429 --> 00:39:08.068
Thank you, Marcia.
00:39:08.088 --> 00:39:10.010
Thank all of you all for being with us.
00:39:10.431 --> 00:39:11.030
Sorry, what was that?
00:39:11.632 --> 00:39:12.391
It's been a pleasure.
00:39:12.472 --> 00:39:13.172
Thank you so much.
00:39:13.552 --> 00:39:14.114
Our pleasure.
00:39:14.893 --> 00:39:16.135
Thank you all for being with us.
00:39:16.315 --> 00:39:17.115
Until next time,
00:39:17.175 --> 00:39:18.617
keep striving for something more.
00:39:20.036 --> 00:39:21.137
Thank you for listening to
00:39:21.197 --> 00:39:22.677
Something More with Chris Boyd.
00:39:23.079 --> 00:39:23.818
Call us for help,
00:39:24.179 --> 00:39:25.280
whether it's for financial
00:39:25.340 --> 00:39:27.019
planning or portfolio management,
00:39:27.400 --> 00:39:28.400
insurance concerns,
00:39:28.800 --> 00:39:30.021
or those quality of life
00:39:30.121 --> 00:39:31.181
issues that make the money
00:39:31.222 --> 00:39:32.322
matters matter.
00:39:32.643 --> 00:39:33.623
Whatever's on your mind,
00:39:33.764 --> 00:39:34.483
visit us at
00:39:34.523 --> 00:39:36.465
somethingmorewithchrisboyd.com
00:39:36.985 --> 00:39:38.726
or call us toll free at 866-771-8901.
00:39:38.846 --> 00:39:41.327
Or send us your questions to
00:39:41.347 --> 00:39:43.088
amr-info at wealthenhancement.com.
00:39:49.010 --> 00:39:49.572
You're listening to
00:39:49.612 --> 00:39:50.431
Something More with Chris
00:39:50.452 --> 00:39:51.552
Boyd Financial Talk Show.
00:39:51.592 --> 00:39:52.673
Wealth Enhancement Advisory
00:39:52.713 --> 00:39:53.875
Services and J. Christopher
00:39:53.894 --> 00:39:54.835
Boyd provide investment
00:39:54.856 --> 00:39:55.936
advice on an individual
00:39:55.996 --> 00:39:57.018
basis to clients only.
00:39:57.157 --> 00:39:58.199
Proper advice depends on a
00:39:58.239 --> 00:39:59.320
complete analysis of all
00:39:59.380 --> 00:40:00.420
facts and circumstances.
00:40:00.621 --> 00:40:01.481
The information given on
00:40:01.501 --> 00:40:02.461
this program is general
00:40:02.521 --> 00:40:03.342
financial comments and
00:40:03.382 --> 00:40:04.443
cannot be relied upon as
00:40:04.483 --> 00:40:06.105
pertaining to your specific situation.
00:40:06.244 --> 00:40:07.005
Wealth Enhancement Group
00:40:07.025 --> 00:40:08.067
cannot guarantee that using
00:40:08.106 --> 00:40:08.947
the information from this
00:40:08.987 --> 00:40:10.088
show will generate profits
00:40:10.148 --> 00:40:11.309
or ensure freedom from loss.
00:40:11.530 --> 00:40:12.349
Listeners should consult
00:40:12.389 --> 00:40:13.070
their own financial
00:40:13.110 --> 00:40:14.132
advisors or conduct their
00:40:14.172 --> 00:40:15.273
own due diligence before
00:40:15.313 --> 00:40:16.653
making any financial decisions.
