To convert or not…that is the question

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Welcome to something more with Chris Boyd.

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Chris Boyd is a certified financial planner, practitioner

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and senior vice president, financial advisor at wealth

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enhancement group.

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One of the nation's largest registered investment advisors.

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We call it something more because we'd like

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to talk not only about those important dollar

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and cents issues, but also the quality of

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life issues that make the money matters matter.

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Here he is your fulfillment facilitator, your partner

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in prosperity, advising clients on Cape Cod and

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across the country.

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Here's your host, Jay Christopher Boyd.

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Welcome to another episode of something more with

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Chris Boyd.

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My name is Jeff Perry.

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I'm a financial advisor with the team AMR

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of wealth enhancement group.

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And I'm sitting in for Chris today, who's

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working with some clients today.

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So he left the control panel to my

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partner today, Russ Ball.

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Russ, welcome.

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Thank you.

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Thank you, Jeff.

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And myself.

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And, um, so we're going to try not

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to screw this up too bad.

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Right, Russ?

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That's right.

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So Russ, you know, for the, for our

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regular listeners, and we have a lot of

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listeners who listen to every episodes.

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And then of course we have occasional listeners

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who listen to some, this could be someone's

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first time hearing you.

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How, how long have you been on part

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of our team now?

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How long has it been?

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So I started on November 4th, I believe.

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So we're coming on three months here.

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Okay.

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Yeah.

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It's been a, it's been a great ride

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so far.

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Time goes quickly.

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I felt more like a month to me,

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maybe six months to you.

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I don't know.

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I know we have the holidays in there,

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a few different, you know, long weekends.

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So, uh, yeah, it's all kind of jumbled

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in with the holidays, but yeah, almost three

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months.

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So how's it going?

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Great, great.

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I love, I love everything about it.

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I, um, um, what do you like the

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most?

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I love to ask like new employees or

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people like, well, first of all, was it,

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is it what you expected?

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It would be working.

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You have some background working in the financial

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services industry, so you probably had some sense

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of what it could be like.

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Is it what you expected?

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Yeah.

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I mean, I feel like it's definitely been

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a better experience than I, than I expected,

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which is, you know, great.

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All I could ask for.

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Um, I, I had exposure to, uh, working

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with a number of different advisor teams throughout

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the country, uh, but actually being on a

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team and a team that, you know, I

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feel like I get along with everyone on

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the team and it's really good, um, environment

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to work in.

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So, uh, that has really surpassed my expectations.

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I'm not surprised that, you know, when I,

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when I joined in March of 21, so

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I'm coming up on my four-year anniversary.

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I knew Chris before.

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I don't think you did.

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No, no.

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No.

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So I knew Chris before, uh, from community.

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We lived in the same community and, um,

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politics and different things that our paths crossed.

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So I had a sense that he and

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Kristen were like super, uh, easy to easygoing

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people with a lot of integrity.

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They really cared about their customers.

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So that's what attracted me.

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You know, I felt like I was going

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into a good environment, but you were kind

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of more in the dark.

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So that's probably why it exceeded your expectations,

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right?

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Yeah.

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And I think from, from the interview phase,

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uh, it was, you know, we, we had

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a good rapport and, um, it seemed like

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the type of team I would really want

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to be joining and pursuing this side of

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my career.

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Well, you've been a great fit so far.

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Is there something that you particularly enjoy as

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your, you know, day-to-day different thing?

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You do a lot of different things cause

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we all do a lot of different things

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to serve our customers.

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But, um, is there something you particularly enjoy?

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Yeah.

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And I have, uh, you know, friends that,

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that know I started a new job recently,

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asked the same question and I referenced the

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fact that, uh, day one, you know, I

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was, I was just getting to know the

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people I was working with.

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I was immediately meeting with clients and a

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big reason why I wanted to work in

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the field as opposed to like the backend,

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the corporate side of this industry is to

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work with clients and to talk to people

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and help people with their, with their financial

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lives.

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So having that exposure day one was like,

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wow, this is, uh, couldn't, couldn't ask for

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more than this.

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Um, so yeah, I think that's been a

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real, you know, and the fact that Chris

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and the team is, you know, trusting me

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to be part of those conversations and getting

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to meet our clients and getting to know

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them has really been amazing.

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So that was the goal.

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And that's what, what I, um, yeah, but

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how it turned out as well.

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So great.

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Well, you're doing a good job, but from

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my point of view, I don't have to

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supervise you obviously, but it seems like you're

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a integral part of the team and gaining

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more value with each passing month.

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Thanks Jeff.

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I feel like definitely learning a lot.

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Um, for sure.

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Yep.

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Um, but I know we, uh, we want

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to hop on here today to talk about

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a article that you recently wrote for the

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street.

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And, uh, I know it was picked up

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by a couple of other publications online, including

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MSN.

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So, um, let's, let's dive into that article

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that you wrote Jeff.

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Yeah.

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To convert or not in 2025 was the

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title that I gave the article and, um,

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you know, I was trying to get some

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eyes on it.

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Right.

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So I didn't want, I wanted to get

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people, you want them to click it, to

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read it.

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Right.

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And it's on mostly financial sites.

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So, you know, when I hear convert, like

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most people, when you're not thinking about finances,

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you're thinking about a religious conversion, right.

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Or something like that.

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So that's not what we're talking about.

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If you're listening in and wondering if we're

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going to try to sway you to one

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denomination or the other, we're going to disappoint

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you.

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But, uh, we're talking about Roth conversions, Roth

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IRAs.

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And so for our, our listeners who may

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not know the term, uh, a Roth IRA

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is an IRA that is a little bit

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different than the traditional IRA in the sense

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that the benefit of a Roth IRA and

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why you would do it is everything that

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you would draw later in life, when you

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retire and you need the funds, or you

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want the funds generally, there's some rules that

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we can dig into, but generally comes out

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tax free.

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The downside, if you will, or the reason

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why some people don't choose to do a

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Roth is that money going in your contributions

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are pre-taxed, right?

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So you don't get that, you know, some

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people contribute to a 401k or an IRA

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in part, because they like the tax deduction

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off their income taxes.

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Right.

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Uh, this is not the case for the

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Roth IRA.

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You, you don't get any deductions for it.

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And the reward is when you take it

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out, you don't pay any taxes.

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So I think over the years, um, the

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value, the inherent value of the Roth IRA

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has been growing and growing, and people really

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kind of want some funds in a Roth

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IRA at some point in their retirement.

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And you can do that through contributions, right?

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You can contribute to an IRA, um, every

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year.

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And there's limits this year, 2025, the limits

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are $7,000.

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I believe into a Roth IRA.

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We'll just talk about those for now.

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Um, and $8,000, if you're 50 or

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over, when you think about contributions, there are

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some income limits.

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So, and this is another reason why some

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people may choose to convert.

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We'll talk about that.

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Um, but if you are a married couple,

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your 2025 contribution of seven or $8,000,

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depending how old you are, if you go

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over $246,000, you are not eligible to

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make a Roth contribution, right?

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If you're under 236,000, you are eligible.

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And there's that $10,000.

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I don't know why they did this.

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I, there's this $10,000 space where you

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can make a partial contribution if you're over

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236, but under 246, just to confuse things

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a little bit more.

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Yeah, I get, they could have a partial

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contribution limit and, you know, they could have

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a partial limit, but to make it only

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$10,000, uh, that Delta is, I don't

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know, I don't see the logic in there,

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but it is, maybe it's just to confuse

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people and keep the CPAs and the financial

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advisors employed.

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Right.

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Could be.

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Well, that, so that's, and that's one piece

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of the, the Roth IRA is the, you

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know, contributions up to 7,000.

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That's what I try to max out every

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year.

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Uh, it's definitely a goal that's seemed, you

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know, relatively attainable for a good amount of

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people.

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And, um, it's something that you're rewarding your

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future self for, for, um, that, you know,

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tax payment that you're basically making right now.

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So, uh, there's the other aspect of that

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as well as the, um, a lot of

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retirement plans through work offer a Roth option.

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So that's another way to, to contribute or

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a tax-free.

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Yeah, that's, that's, that's, that's really something relatively

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new.

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You know, when people have a 401k or

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whatever the retirement plan they have, I think

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most people have 401ks.

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Some people have simple IRAs.

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If maybe they're working for a small company

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or a SEP, if they're, you know, working

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individually, but thinking about the 401ks when 401ks

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have been around for decades, but you didn't

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00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:23,360
have the Roth option and even when you

274
00:09:23,360 --> 00:09:25,600
started to have the Roth option legally, a

275
00:09:25,600 --> 00:09:28,300
lot of companies didn't adopt it for their

276
00:09:28,300 --> 00:09:29,240
particular employees.

277
00:09:29,360 --> 00:09:32,380
But I think the demand from employees, you

278
00:09:32,380 --> 00:09:35,220
know, asking their HR directors and their supervisors,

279
00:09:35,760 --> 00:09:36,480
can I have a Roth?

280
00:09:36,560 --> 00:09:38,640
Can I have a Roth is really grown.

281
00:09:38,780 --> 00:09:41,120
And it's, I'd say it's, I don't know.

282
00:09:41,220 --> 00:09:41,600
Do you agree?

283
00:09:41,680 --> 00:09:43,140
It's kind of the standard now that most

284
00:09:43,140 --> 00:09:46,200
corporations that you work for have that Roth

285
00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:46,600
option.

286
00:09:47,200 --> 00:09:48,300
At least from what I've seen.

287
00:09:48,380 --> 00:09:49,100
Yeah, probably.

288
00:09:49,800 --> 00:09:52,440
You know, definitely the larger corporations out there

289
00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:53,920
would, would, would offer that as an option.

290
00:09:54,080 --> 00:09:56,860
Now, again, it comes back to the question,

291
00:09:56,920 --> 00:09:58,740
like you said, you know, would I rather

292
00:09:58,740 --> 00:10:01,660
pay taxes on an hour or down the

293
00:10:01,660 --> 00:10:01,860
road?

294
00:10:01,880 --> 00:10:03,400
And a lot of the time people like

295
00:10:03,400 --> 00:10:08,340
those 401ks, those traditional 401ks, because that money

296
00:10:08,340 --> 00:10:11,260
goes in pre-tax from your, from your

297
00:10:11,260 --> 00:10:11,500
paycheck.

298
00:10:11,820 --> 00:10:14,620
So there's obviously a lot to like there,

299
00:10:14,620 --> 00:10:17,000
but then the Roth portion, and I think

300
00:10:17,000 --> 00:10:19,220
we'll, we'll dive more into this is something

301
00:10:19,220 --> 00:10:21,860
that can really be beneficial when you're entering

302
00:10:21,860 --> 00:10:23,560
that retirement visa or nearing that retirement.

303
00:10:23,920 --> 00:10:24,140
Yeah.

304
00:10:24,220 --> 00:10:26,240
And like so many things in the financial

305
00:10:26,240 --> 00:10:30,700
planning sector is it depends, you know, what's

306
00:10:30,700 --> 00:10:31,300
your best choice?

307
00:10:31,440 --> 00:10:32,080
It depends.

308
00:10:32,080 --> 00:10:32,440
Right.

309
00:10:33,280 --> 00:10:35,800
And it also is not an all or

310
00:10:35,800 --> 00:10:36,060
nothing.

311
00:10:36,060 --> 00:10:38,200
So if you're just starting out, for example,

312
00:10:38,200 --> 00:10:39,420
and you're saying, all right, this is my

313
00:10:39,420 --> 00:10:40,880
first real job.

314
00:10:41,220 --> 00:10:45,200
I have this opportunity to make contributions to

315
00:10:45,200 --> 00:10:46,420
both, to either.

316
00:10:47,400 --> 00:10:48,320
That's your choice.

317
00:10:48,480 --> 00:10:49,700
You can do either or both.

318
00:10:49,840 --> 00:10:51,580
You can, most companies let you split it

319
00:10:51,580 --> 00:10:51,840
up.

320
00:10:52,040 --> 00:10:53,940
So I'd love it.

321
00:10:54,060 --> 00:10:57,280
I love when clients or people that I

322
00:10:57,280 --> 00:11:00,560
advise do both because the younger you are,

323
00:11:00,820 --> 00:11:02,340
you know, you get all this years of

324
00:11:02,340 --> 00:11:05,220
compounding and you get all this, this years

325
00:11:05,220 --> 00:11:08,340
of growth and all of that.

326
00:11:08,540 --> 00:11:09,060
Think about that.

327
00:11:09,120 --> 00:11:11,320
You know, when you retire, if you're starting

328
00:11:11,320 --> 00:11:13,580
at 25, if you retire in 30 or

329
00:11:13,580 --> 00:11:16,380
40 years, getting all those earnings and all

330
00:11:16,380 --> 00:11:20,340
that growth and in a setting, a setting

331
00:11:20,340 --> 00:11:22,840
that is totally tax free, that, that is

332
00:11:22,840 --> 00:11:23,700
pretty powerful.

333
00:11:24,520 --> 00:11:24,900
Yeah.

334
00:11:25,180 --> 00:11:25,400
Yeah.

335
00:11:25,440 --> 00:11:26,840
And that's a big reason why a lot

336
00:11:26,840 --> 00:11:29,300
of people like to use the Roth as

337
00:11:29,300 --> 00:11:31,640
something to use at the very end when

338
00:11:31,640 --> 00:11:33,360
the last, the last thing that you touch

339
00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:35,360
in retirement, because it's has all that growth

340
00:11:35,360 --> 00:11:38,080
potential without the tax impact and without the

341
00:11:38,080 --> 00:11:40,380
RMDs, but I know we'll dive into a

342
00:11:40,380 --> 00:11:42,560
little bit more, I think back to the

343
00:11:42,560 --> 00:11:46,780
conversion question, I think in your article, Jeff,

344
00:11:46,820 --> 00:11:48,440
you, you write about a couple of questions

345
00:11:48,440 --> 00:11:51,120
that investors need to consider before they think,

346
00:11:51,260 --> 00:11:53,540
Oh, let's just convert everything or, or let's

347
00:11:53,540 --> 00:11:54,440
not do a conversion at all.

348
00:11:54,560 --> 00:11:56,340
What, what do you, what do you make?

349
00:11:56,500 --> 00:11:58,560
What do you think those two key questions

350
00:11:58,560 --> 00:12:00,020
are for, for investors?

351
00:12:00,720 --> 00:12:00,840
Right.

352
00:12:01,460 --> 00:12:04,620
So two questions, whether or not you, so

353
00:12:04,620 --> 00:12:07,080
the scenario is the typical scenario is you

354
00:12:07,080 --> 00:12:10,840
have all or most of your retirement savings

355
00:12:10,840 --> 00:12:15,440
in a traditional IRA or traditional 401k, and

356
00:12:15,440 --> 00:12:17,340
you're now being, you know, you're getting older

357
00:12:17,340 --> 00:12:19,840
and you're thinking about your planning and you're

358
00:12:19,840 --> 00:12:22,800
saying, gee, I really wish I had some

359
00:12:22,800 --> 00:12:24,880
money in a Roth so later I could

360
00:12:24,880 --> 00:12:27,300
get this money out tax free, or later

361
00:12:27,300 --> 00:12:30,180
I could give a bequest this money to

362
00:12:30,180 --> 00:12:32,440
my heirs and transfer tax free and they

363
00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:34,240
could have a tax free or whatever the

364
00:12:34,240 --> 00:12:35,720
reasons is, or I don't want to take

365
00:12:35,720 --> 00:12:36,520
RMD someday.

366
00:12:36,520 --> 00:12:37,740
I don't think I'm going to need it.

367
00:12:37,880 --> 00:12:40,160
So there's no RMD in a Roth.

368
00:12:40,320 --> 00:12:42,900
So that you're at, people are asking themselves

369
00:12:42,900 --> 00:12:45,120
or clients are asking us, so should I,

370
00:12:45,500 --> 00:12:48,540
should I convert, which the IRS code allows

371
00:12:48,540 --> 00:12:52,740
us to do some or all of traditional

372
00:12:52,740 --> 00:12:56,680
IRA to a Roth conversion?

373
00:12:57,060 --> 00:13:00,280
So the question is, do I want to

374
00:13:00,280 --> 00:13:02,560
pay the taxes now to convert?

375
00:13:02,560 --> 00:13:05,800
Because any amount you convert a traditional IRA

376
00:13:05,800 --> 00:13:10,440
to a Roth IRA is 100% taxable.

377
00:13:11,000 --> 00:13:12,860
So if you're going to convert, say you

378
00:13:12,860 --> 00:13:15,500
have a IRA for a hundred thousand dollars

379
00:13:16,040 --> 00:13:18,360
and you convert the a hundred thousand dollars

380
00:13:18,360 --> 00:13:20,580
in that year that you convert that a

381
00:13:20,580 --> 00:13:23,700
hundred thousand dollars, that is all ordinary income.

382
00:13:23,820 --> 00:13:25,740
It goes on to your earned income.

383
00:13:26,320 --> 00:13:27,860
You're going to be taxed on it.

384
00:13:28,520 --> 00:13:30,620
So is it worth it to do that?

385
00:13:30,620 --> 00:13:32,660
And those two questions that you alluded to

386
00:13:32,660 --> 00:13:36,920
are, where am I in my own personal

387
00:13:36,920 --> 00:13:40,280
income level and my own tax bracket in

388
00:13:40,280 --> 00:13:41,680
the year that I'm going to do it?

389
00:13:42,200 --> 00:13:46,140
So let's say for example, you're in a

390
00:13:46,140 --> 00:13:49,040
year that happens to be, for some reason,

391
00:13:49,560 --> 00:13:51,720
you're having a low level of earned income

392
00:13:51,720 --> 00:13:52,300
that year.

393
00:13:52,700 --> 00:13:56,440
Maybe you've started a business, maybe you're been

394
00:13:56,440 --> 00:13:57,400
unemployed for a while.

395
00:13:57,460 --> 00:13:58,500
You took a sabbatical.

396
00:13:58,980 --> 00:14:01,120
Whatever the situation is, you just happen that

397
00:14:01,120 --> 00:14:03,140
year to have an income level that's less

398
00:14:03,140 --> 00:14:04,300
than you normally have.

399
00:14:05,140 --> 00:14:06,800
So therefore you have a tax bracket.

400
00:14:06,920 --> 00:14:09,400
You're probably in a lower tax bracket than

401
00:14:09,400 --> 00:14:11,300
you usually are, than you expect to be

402
00:14:11,300 --> 00:14:12,260
in the future, right?

403
00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:15,320
So if you are, and you're thinking about

404
00:14:15,320 --> 00:14:17,280
a Roth conversion, the fact that your income

405
00:14:17,280 --> 00:14:20,300
is level in this given tax year, it's

406
00:14:20,300 --> 00:14:23,020
a compelling reason on the plus side of

407
00:14:23,020 --> 00:14:25,560
doing a conversion because you might still be

408
00:14:25,560 --> 00:14:27,060
in the, you know, to use the extreme

409
00:14:27,060 --> 00:14:29,240
example, you might still be in the 15

410
00:14:29,240 --> 00:14:32,880
% tax bracket and maybe you believe in

411
00:14:32,880 --> 00:14:35,240
your future earnings years or historically you've been

412
00:14:35,240 --> 00:14:38,480
in the 24% tax bracket, so this

413
00:14:38,480 --> 00:14:42,180
could strategically be a reason to convert the

414
00:14:42,180 --> 00:14:42,740
money this year.

415
00:14:42,860 --> 00:14:44,480
And on the flip side, let's say you're

416
00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:48,000
thinking about a Roth conversion for 2025 and

417
00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:49,780
you're in a really, you're in a peak

418
00:14:49,780 --> 00:14:50,800
of your earning season.

419
00:14:50,800 --> 00:14:54,140
Uh, you're, you know, you're making two, $300

420
00:14:54,140 --> 00:14:57,240
,000 a year, you're, you know, your, your

421
00:14:57,240 --> 00:14:58,500
tax brackets up there.

422
00:14:59,280 --> 00:15:02,240
And you might even jump tax brackets by

423
00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:05,900
adding this $100,000 in hypothetical Roth conversion

424
00:15:05,900 --> 00:15:07,320
to your income.

425
00:15:07,320 --> 00:15:10,360
And you might be paying more in taxes

426
00:15:10,360 --> 00:15:12,020
than you might later in life.

427
00:15:12,600 --> 00:15:14,520
So it might not be the right time.

428
00:15:14,780 --> 00:15:17,140
That's kind of the first question is where

429
00:15:17,140 --> 00:15:19,580
are you in your own income tax bracket

430
00:15:19,580 --> 00:15:20,000
level?

431
00:15:20,420 --> 00:15:22,220
Is it a good time for you personally

432
00:15:22,220 --> 00:15:23,500
to think about this?

433
00:15:24,500 --> 00:15:24,620
Right.

434
00:15:24,800 --> 00:15:26,560
And I think a lot of, uh, clients

435
00:15:26,560 --> 00:15:28,340
have been asking about Roth conversions.

436
00:15:28,540 --> 00:15:30,840
I think it's, um, kind of gaining a

437
00:15:30,840 --> 00:15:31,800
little bit more popularity.

438
00:15:32,280 --> 00:15:34,060
Uh, people are starting to consider these types

439
00:15:34,060 --> 00:15:34,460
of things.

440
00:15:34,720 --> 00:15:37,220
And, um, it really does come down to,

441
00:15:37,420 --> 00:15:39,440
well, uh, where's your income now?

442
00:15:40,280 --> 00:15:43,300
And, um, is it, is there any, uh,

443
00:15:43,520 --> 00:15:44,780
is there any period in the, in the

444
00:15:44,780 --> 00:15:45,800
next couple of years where it's going to

445
00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:47,820
be lower or is there anything you anticipate

446
00:15:47,820 --> 00:15:48,900
that would, would make it lower?

447
00:15:49,060 --> 00:15:51,140
And if it's lower, obviously it leaves more

448
00:15:51,140 --> 00:15:53,880
of that room in that tax bracket to,

449
00:15:54,000 --> 00:15:56,180
uh, to get some more, some more income

450
00:15:56,180 --> 00:15:58,020
and not, not have a big effect on

451
00:15:58,020 --> 00:15:58,400
it.

452
00:15:58,660 --> 00:15:58,760
Right.

453
00:15:59,020 --> 00:16:01,600
So there's two like little asterisks I'll put

454
00:16:01,600 --> 00:16:04,360
next to those comments, like danger, danger, go

455
00:16:04,360 --> 00:16:04,660
away.

456
00:16:04,840 --> 00:16:08,080
You know, um, one is Irma, which is

457
00:16:08,080 --> 00:16:08,800
a.

458
00:16:10,220 --> 00:16:12,940
Calculation that they have when you're a couple

459
00:16:12,940 --> 00:16:15,120
of years out from filing for Medicare at

460
00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:16,040
age 65.

461
00:16:17,180 --> 00:16:19,680
Medicare looks at your income two years back.

462
00:16:19,800 --> 00:16:22,820
So say when you hit age 63 to

463
00:16:22,820 --> 00:16:25,180
calculate what your premium will be for Medicare.

464
00:16:25,460 --> 00:16:27,600
So you may be thinking, well, I'm retiring

465
00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:29,240
when I'm 62.

466
00:16:30,840 --> 00:16:32,620
Um, so my income is going to be

467
00:16:32,620 --> 00:16:33,040
low.

468
00:16:33,200 --> 00:16:34,860
I'm just going to be using my investment.

469
00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:36,500
So I'm not going to have any earned

470
00:16:36,500 --> 00:16:36,800
income.

471
00:16:36,860 --> 00:16:38,060
I'm just going to investment income.

472
00:16:38,140 --> 00:16:42,080
So maybe I'll convert my a hundred thousand

473
00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:42,460
dollars.

474
00:16:42,500 --> 00:16:43,780
We'll just keep that same figure.

475
00:16:44,340 --> 00:16:48,100
When I'm 63 and I'm in a very

476
00:16:48,100 --> 00:16:50,200
low tax bracket, well, that's going to be

477
00:16:50,200 --> 00:16:52,000
on your tax return, discerned income, right?

478
00:16:53,080 --> 00:16:54,740
So it could, you could do it at

479
00:16:54,740 --> 00:16:56,960
exactly the wrong time when you're thinking about

480
00:16:56,960 --> 00:16:59,080
how low is my Medicare premium going to

481
00:16:59,080 --> 00:16:59,700
be, right?

482
00:17:00,420 --> 00:17:02,340
So that's something you just got to like,

483
00:17:02,500 --> 00:17:04,240
stay away from if you're close to that

484
00:17:04,240 --> 00:17:07,160
age or some, or some other type of

485
00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:09,339
benefit that you may be able to receive.

486
00:17:09,339 --> 00:17:10,460
That's based on income.

487
00:17:10,460 --> 00:17:12,500
Just be aware that this is going to

488
00:17:12,500 --> 00:17:14,960
come as a taxable event.

489
00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:17,099
That's going to look like income on your

490
00:17:17,099 --> 00:17:19,220
tax return and it could skew a different

491
00:17:19,220 --> 00:17:19,660
benefit.

492
00:17:19,920 --> 00:17:22,380
The other asterisks I want to make is

493
00:17:22,380 --> 00:17:25,440
this is not a all or nothing proposition.

494
00:17:26,200 --> 00:17:28,580
We're using this a hundred thousand dollar example,

495
00:17:29,300 --> 00:17:31,420
but if you are in, say you're in

496
00:17:31,420 --> 00:17:34,440
the 22% tax bracket and you've got

497
00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:36,080
a little bit of room before you jump

498
00:17:36,080 --> 00:17:39,320
up to the 24% tax bracket, meaning

499
00:17:39,320 --> 00:17:42,940
you, your income is like $20,000 below

500
00:17:42,940 --> 00:17:43,960
the next tax bracket.

501
00:17:44,160 --> 00:17:47,540
Well, you can convert $20,000 and stay

502
00:17:47,540 --> 00:17:49,220
within the tax bracket you're in.

503
00:17:50,020 --> 00:17:52,760
You don't have to convert your entire IRA.

504
00:17:53,080 --> 00:17:55,460
You convert as much as you're comfortable with,

505
00:17:55,540 --> 00:17:58,240
or maybe as much as you want to

506
00:17:58,240 --> 00:17:59,000
pay taxes on.

507
00:17:59,100 --> 00:18:02,100
Because, you know, sometimes people get in trouble

508
00:18:02,100 --> 00:18:04,640
by making financial decisions in life that impact

509
00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:05,220
your taxes.

510
00:18:05,380 --> 00:18:06,820
And they say, I'll worry about the taxes

511
00:18:06,820 --> 00:18:07,260
later.

512
00:18:07,660 --> 00:18:08,140
Yeah.

513
00:18:08,300 --> 00:18:10,280
So if you're converting this kind of, you

514
00:18:10,280 --> 00:18:12,440
know, big money here, a hundred thousand dollars,

515
00:18:12,540 --> 00:18:14,220
$50,000, whatever it is.

516
00:18:15,220 --> 00:18:18,880
You have the option of withholding the taxes

517
00:18:18,880 --> 00:18:22,420
from the conversion, paying the taxes through withholding,

518
00:18:22,600 --> 00:18:26,020
which is not wrong, we don't suggest it.

519
00:18:26,080 --> 00:18:29,300
We'd rather have you pay the taxes from

520
00:18:29,300 --> 00:18:33,980
other taxable accounts or savings that you have

521
00:18:33,980 --> 00:18:36,360
so you don't lose the money that's in

522
00:18:36,360 --> 00:18:37,640
that IRA setting.

523
00:18:38,020 --> 00:18:40,420
But whichever way you do it, make sure

524
00:18:40,420 --> 00:18:42,760
you are prepared to pay the taxes.

525
00:18:43,040 --> 00:18:43,140
Right.

526
00:18:43,660 --> 00:18:43,940
Yeah.

527
00:18:44,080 --> 00:18:46,020
I think that's a, that's a key point.

528
00:18:46,120 --> 00:18:49,500
Um, in order to really maximize, and you

529
00:18:49,500 --> 00:18:50,780
read about this in the article too, in

530
00:18:50,780 --> 00:18:53,360
order to maximize the benefit of that Roth

531
00:18:53,360 --> 00:18:55,820
IRA, that it's not taxable.

532
00:18:56,040 --> 00:18:58,460
You don't want to take tax money out

533
00:18:58,460 --> 00:18:59,820
of there to pay the taxes.

534
00:18:59,820 --> 00:19:03,560
So if, if you anticipate a Roth coming,

535
00:19:03,700 --> 00:19:06,020
I mean, a Roth conversion coming up, having

536
00:19:06,020 --> 00:19:08,080
some money saved on the sidelines to pay

537
00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:10,420
those taxes would be the ideal way to.

538
00:19:10,760 --> 00:19:11,520
It is the ideal way.

539
00:19:11,620 --> 00:19:14,160
And this is where age, your age starts

540
00:19:14,160 --> 00:19:15,360
to come into it.

541
00:19:15,420 --> 00:19:17,660
Um, cause in essence, you're, let's say you're

542
00:19:17,660 --> 00:19:19,400
in the 24% tax bracket.

543
00:19:20,060 --> 00:19:21,520
And if you live in a state with

544
00:19:21,520 --> 00:19:23,780
a state income tax, that might be another

545
00:19:23,780 --> 00:19:26,600
5% for Massachusetts, I think that's what

546
00:19:26,600 --> 00:19:26,940
it is.

547
00:19:26,940 --> 00:19:29,300
So, you know, you're close to 30%

548
00:19:29,300 --> 00:19:33,420
that's going to be contributed from another account

549
00:19:33,420 --> 00:19:34,200
or withheld.

550
00:19:35,180 --> 00:19:39,500
And if you're nearing retirement, even though it's

551
00:19:39,500 --> 00:19:40,860
still going to be in this tax-free

552
00:19:40,860 --> 00:19:43,120
setting after the conversion, it depends on when

553
00:19:43,120 --> 00:19:45,420
you're going to be withdrawing, if you, it

554
00:19:45,420 --> 00:19:46,840
doesn't make a lot of sense if you're

555
00:19:46,840 --> 00:19:49,700
going to convert and then start withdrawing.

556
00:19:49,780 --> 00:19:50,220
Right.

557
00:19:50,460 --> 00:19:52,380
Like, cause you're going to miss all those

558
00:19:52,380 --> 00:19:54,740
additional years of tax-free compounding.

559
00:19:54,800 --> 00:19:55,040
Right.

560
00:19:55,860 --> 00:19:56,140
Yeah.

561
00:19:56,140 --> 00:19:57,620
So there's a lot of thought that goes

562
00:19:57,620 --> 00:20:00,480
into, you know, your own personal situation, when

563
00:20:00,480 --> 00:20:01,340
do I need the money?

564
00:20:02,100 --> 00:20:03,380
What's my current tax bracket?

565
00:20:03,440 --> 00:20:04,980
What do I think it's going to be?

566
00:20:05,460 --> 00:20:07,560
And these other caveats of, should I do

567
00:20:07,560 --> 00:20:08,100
a little bit?

568
00:20:08,180 --> 00:20:08,940
Should I do a lot?

569
00:20:09,240 --> 00:20:11,400
Does this affect any other benefits I have

570
00:20:11,400 --> 00:20:12,100
like Medicare?

571
00:20:13,360 --> 00:20:13,680
Right.

572
00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:17,300
Uh, the other, the other question of my

573
00:20:17,300 --> 00:20:19,240
two part question, that was a long part

574
00:20:19,240 --> 00:20:20,060
of question one.

575
00:20:20,640 --> 00:20:23,620
Uh, the other one's simpler, but less clear,

576
00:20:23,640 --> 00:20:23,900
right?

577
00:20:23,900 --> 00:20:26,560
So the question is, where do you think

578
00:20:26,560 --> 00:20:30,660
federal income taxes are headed in the future?

579
00:20:31,380 --> 00:20:33,460
So we have the tax cuts and job

580
00:20:33,460 --> 00:20:35,840
deck that we're living in now, um, where

581
00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:37,660
the brackets were reduced.

582
00:20:38,340 --> 00:20:40,320
And so we're, we're in a period of

583
00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:44,580
lower than typical, lower than historical income taxes.

584
00:20:45,060 --> 00:20:48,020
It, you know, president Trump was reelected or

585
00:20:48,020 --> 00:20:48,400
elected.

586
00:20:48,580 --> 00:20:49,420
How would you say that?

587
00:20:49,460 --> 00:20:50,860
Cause he had a hiatus.

588
00:20:51,860 --> 00:20:52,360
Yep.

589
00:20:52,360 --> 00:20:56,040
So he's in office and he's hoping to

590
00:20:56,040 --> 00:20:58,880
pass an extension to that tax cut and

591
00:20:58,880 --> 00:20:59,500
jobs act.

592
00:21:00,380 --> 00:21:01,980
And so we could be staying in these

593
00:21:01,980 --> 00:21:04,000
tax rates for a few more years.

594
00:21:04,040 --> 00:21:06,160
So that's good, but kind of your, your

595
00:21:06,160 --> 00:21:08,440
general sense of where do you think income

596
00:21:08,440 --> 00:21:09,360
taxes are headed?

597
00:21:10,060 --> 00:21:11,800
And you may say, well, I have no

598
00:21:11,800 --> 00:21:12,140
idea.

599
00:21:12,280 --> 00:21:13,540
Taxes go up and go down.

600
00:21:13,640 --> 00:21:15,260
How would I be able to predict that?

601
00:21:15,340 --> 00:21:18,800
Well, that's an accurate thought, but you can

602
00:21:18,800 --> 00:21:20,100
think about it generally.

603
00:21:20,100 --> 00:21:22,040
You know, we're in a period of record

604
00:21:22,040 --> 00:21:25,680
high budget deficits and national debt levels of

605
00:21:25,680 --> 00:21:27,000
$37 trillion.

606
00:21:27,500 --> 00:21:31,160
We have a social security crisis coming in

607
00:21:31,160 --> 00:21:33,340
nine years where, you know, if we don't

608
00:21:33,340 --> 00:21:36,320
do reforms, which reforms usually cost us money,

609
00:21:36,440 --> 00:21:36,620
right.

610
00:21:37,660 --> 00:21:40,760
And money comes primarily from taxes.

611
00:21:41,460 --> 00:21:44,340
Um, and then we have Medicare that needs

612
00:21:44,340 --> 00:21:45,540
to be reformed as well.

613
00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:49,300
We are having a peace through strength type,

614
00:21:49,400 --> 00:21:52,740
uh, president, which means increased military spending.

615
00:21:53,080 --> 00:21:55,160
I know they have doge and they're trying

616
00:21:55,160 --> 00:21:56,760
to cut spending and I wish them well,

617
00:21:56,900 --> 00:21:57,740
but it's tough.

618
00:21:58,540 --> 00:22:02,000
So, you know, the question is, do you

619
00:22:02,000 --> 00:22:05,880
think after president Trump say, do you think

620
00:22:05,880 --> 00:22:07,840
that there is a period of higher or

621
00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:08,980
lower federal taxes?

622
00:22:09,260 --> 00:22:12,900
Which means I'm going to pay higher federal

623
00:22:12,900 --> 00:22:16,180
taxes if I do a Roth conversion later,

624
00:22:16,180 --> 00:22:18,780
or if all my money is in a

625
00:22:18,780 --> 00:22:20,420
traditional IRA, when it comes out.

626
00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:24,900
So if you believe that higher taxes are

627
00:22:24,900 --> 00:22:27,160
in your future, either when you do a

628
00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:29,040
conversion or when you would draw your traditional

629
00:22:29,040 --> 00:22:31,840
money, that kind of puts the thumb on

630
00:22:31,840 --> 00:22:34,880
the scale to say, maybe it's a good

631
00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:36,520
time to do it now.

632
00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:37,360
Right.

633
00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:37,620
Right.

634
00:22:37,960 --> 00:22:38,200
Yeah.

635
00:22:38,580 --> 00:22:39,520
At least that's my logic.

636
00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:42,100
I think, so I was listening to a,

637
00:22:42,100 --> 00:22:44,800
uh, another podcast with, um, a guy named

638
00:22:44,800 --> 00:22:47,540
Ed slot and his name is very familiar

639
00:22:47,540 --> 00:22:50,680
in the, uh, wealth management industry and finance

640
00:22:50,680 --> 00:22:53,340
in general, he is a sort of, uh,

641
00:22:53,340 --> 00:22:56,200
IRA and, um, as a tax expert, tax

642
00:22:56,200 --> 00:22:58,720
guru, uh, he's the go-to guy really

643
00:22:58,720 --> 00:23:00,300
out there in the United States.

644
00:23:00,300 --> 00:23:01,400
He is, he is.

645
00:23:01,460 --> 00:23:04,160
And, um, what he was saying was, uh,

646
00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:07,040
you know, yeah, you might think like some

647
00:23:07,040 --> 00:23:08,720
people might think that taxes are going to

648
00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:09,420
be lower in the future.

649
00:23:10,040 --> 00:23:11,260
Uh, they've done a bunch of surveys.

650
00:23:11,580 --> 00:23:13,680
Most people don't think that most people think

651
00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:14,780
it's probably going to go higher.

652
00:23:14,980 --> 00:23:17,720
So, uh, if that's the case, taxes may

653
00:23:17,720 --> 00:23:18,940
not be lower than they are today.

654
00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:20,200
Why not take advantage?

655
00:23:20,400 --> 00:23:22,980
Um, ASAP, if, you know, if it matches

656
00:23:22,980 --> 00:23:24,300
what you're, what you're looking for and what

657
00:23:24,300 --> 00:23:24,880
your needs are.

658
00:23:25,020 --> 00:23:25,420
Yeah.

659
00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:28,680
Um, and yeah, I think, uh, his point

660
00:23:28,680 --> 00:23:31,220
as well in that, in that podcast, uh,

661
00:23:31,220 --> 00:23:33,600
that I was listening to was, uh, he's,

662
00:23:33,700 --> 00:23:35,520
he loves, uh, the Roth IRA.

663
00:23:35,520 --> 00:23:37,680
He does not seem to love a traditional

664
00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:40,700
IRA just because, uh, you know, the, the

665
00:23:40,700 --> 00:23:44,900
tax impact of, of taking RMDs and, and,

666
00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:48,340
um, over time that basically increasing your, your

667
00:23:48,340 --> 00:23:51,360
tax bracket and, um, making it pay, pay

668
00:23:51,360 --> 00:23:52,360
more in taxes potentially.

669
00:23:52,780 --> 00:23:56,320
So, um, definitely a lot of, uh, uh,

670
00:23:56,320 --> 00:23:57,280
key things to consider.

671
00:23:57,500 --> 00:23:59,720
Um, one question I had for you as

672
00:23:59,720 --> 00:24:02,740
well, Jeff, uh, when would someone typically think

673
00:24:02,740 --> 00:24:04,360
about, uh, a Roth conversion?

674
00:24:04,500 --> 00:24:05,800
When would be at me like an ideal

675
00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:06,080
time?

676
00:24:06,120 --> 00:24:07,140
And I know it, it depends.

677
00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:09,360
It's different for everyone's circumstances, but if a

678
00:24:09,360 --> 00:24:11,120
Roth conversion was something that really wanted to

679
00:24:11,120 --> 00:24:12,220
do, or really we're considering.

680
00:24:12,740 --> 00:24:14,560
When would be a typical time in the

681
00:24:14,560 --> 00:24:16,260
life cycle and the career cycle that would

682
00:24:16,260 --> 00:24:16,860
take place?

683
00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:20,700
I think anytime that you're starting to build

684
00:24:20,700 --> 00:24:23,240
wealth, you know, you have control of your

685
00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:26,360
budget, your meeting, your expense, monthly expenses, you

686
00:24:26,360 --> 00:24:28,620
have your emergency fund, you're saving for retirement,

687
00:24:28,620 --> 00:24:30,960
I think as early as when you start

688
00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:33,140
saving for retirement is a, you know, that's

689
00:24:33,140 --> 00:24:34,660
not so much a conversion is where should

690
00:24:34,660 --> 00:24:35,640
I put my money?

691
00:24:35,800 --> 00:24:35,940
Right.

692
00:24:36,240 --> 00:24:39,440
But at any time, uh, before your retirement,

693
00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:41,920
you should be thinking about this and if

694
00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:45,220
you're working with a trusted financial advisor, fiduciary,

695
00:24:45,380 --> 00:24:47,380
someone who has your best interest at heart

696
00:24:47,380 --> 00:24:50,080
as compared to maybe someone selling you a

697
00:24:50,080 --> 00:24:50,780
product, right.

698
00:24:51,120 --> 00:24:53,760
Someone who's compensated, not on what they sell

699
00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:56,360
you, but on how well you do generally

700
00:24:56,360 --> 00:24:56,900
speaking.

701
00:24:56,900 --> 00:25:00,600
Um, sit down with them and discuss it.

702
00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:02,400
There's so many factors, you know, we're just

703
00:25:02,400 --> 00:25:05,140
touching on kind of the big ones here,

704
00:25:05,180 --> 00:25:08,020
but, you know, I'll just touch on a

705
00:25:08,020 --> 00:25:09,440
few other reasons why you might want to

706
00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:12,040
have a Roth and so, which would add,

707
00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:15,540
um, add the thumb on the scale to

708
00:25:15,540 --> 00:25:17,480
maybe I should talk to my advisor about

709
00:25:17,480 --> 00:25:20,840
this is it's stay with me on this.

710
00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:23,460
Cause it's kind of counterintuitive.

711
00:25:23,460 --> 00:25:25,440
You know, a lot of people, one of

712
00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:28,240
their biggest, um, risks to their financial plan

713
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:29,360
and one of the things they worry about

714
00:25:29,360 --> 00:25:31,880
the most is a long-term care event.

715
00:25:33,120 --> 00:25:36,220
And they go through that process of, should

716
00:25:36,220 --> 00:25:38,880
I buy insurance or, you know, should I

717
00:25:38,880 --> 00:25:41,320
have a trust and hide, not hide, uh,

718
00:25:41,420 --> 00:25:44,880
segregate all of my assets from potentially receiving

719
00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:46,580
some government assistance, right?

720
00:25:46,660 --> 00:25:47,860
How am I going to handle this?

721
00:25:47,860 --> 00:25:50,560
This could be three or $400,000 event.

722
00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:52,840
If I was in a long-term care

723
00:25:52,840 --> 00:25:54,780
and it's not covered by Medicare, the only

724
00:25:54,780 --> 00:25:55,980
the first a hundred days is.

725
00:25:56,340 --> 00:26:00,860
So a Roth, well, well, not designed for,

726
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:03,600
or commonly thought of, of, of a way

727
00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:06,200
to dealing with future long-term care event

728
00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:08,040
can be just that if.

729
00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:10,060
And why would I use a Roth?

730
00:26:10,180 --> 00:26:12,000
Well, you'd use a Roth because you never

731
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:13,220
have to take money out.

732
00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:16,440
Meaning you don't have RMDs.

733
00:26:16,500 --> 00:26:18,340
If you have a traditional IRA that you're

734
00:26:18,340 --> 00:26:20,200
thinking, well, I can use my IRA money.

735
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:22,600
Remember two things about that traditional IRA.

736
00:26:22,820 --> 00:26:25,320
One is at age 73 or 75, you're

737
00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:27,520
going to be taking our RMDs so that

738
00:26:27,520 --> 00:26:29,580
you're going to be diminishing that account, which

739
00:26:29,580 --> 00:26:31,020
is what you're supposed to do in retirement,

740
00:26:31,120 --> 00:26:34,220
you're supposed to take your money and it's

741
00:26:34,220 --> 00:26:35,700
taxable when it comes out.

742
00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:38,520
So if you're taking large chunks out of

743
00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:40,700
that to fund a long-term care event,

744
00:26:41,500 --> 00:26:44,280
you're adding another 30% to your withdrawals

745
00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:45,880
or the cost of your long-term care

746
00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:46,160
event.

747
00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:47,140
Right.

748
00:26:47,140 --> 00:26:49,880
So if you have these funds, segregated funds

749
00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:53,160
in a Roth, it can serve certainly to

750
00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:55,840
supplement your retirement if you need it, but

751
00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:58,440
if you don't need it, especially in the

752
00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:00,620
early part of your retirement, and it's just

753
00:27:00,620 --> 00:27:04,980
building compounding, it's a great segregated nest egg

754
00:27:04,980 --> 00:27:07,880
to say, well, I've saved this and it's

755
00:27:07,880 --> 00:27:09,580
here for long-term care.

756
00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:11,120
If I need it.

757
00:27:11,320 --> 00:27:13,300
Another reason to have a Roth and to

758
00:27:13,300 --> 00:27:16,320
consider a conversion and build up that account

759
00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:20,600
is legacy, a Roth.

760
00:27:21,420 --> 00:27:23,940
So if you pass for the Roth and

761
00:27:23,940 --> 00:27:27,880
your beneficiaries, they receive that tax free.

762
00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:32,040
If it's a spouse, that Roth can be

763
00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:33,680
inherited to the spouse.

764
00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:34,820
They just keep the Roth.

765
00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:37,920
There's no withdrawal schedule.

766
00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:39,660
There's no RMDs for the spouse.

767
00:27:40,180 --> 00:27:42,700
They just have it all come out tax

768
00:27:42,700 --> 00:27:42,920
free.

769
00:27:42,920 --> 00:27:44,440
If it's not a spouse, there's a five

770
00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:46,920
-year rule on that, but the funds still

771
00:27:46,920 --> 00:27:48,140
come out tax free.

772
00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:52,240
There's some asterisks there, if the money's been

773
00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:54,180
there for five years and so forth.

774
00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:56,160
So it's a great way to think about

775
00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:57,240
legacy as well.

776
00:27:59,860 --> 00:28:03,160
If you receive an inheritance, you're thankful that

777
00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:04,260
your loved one left you something.

778
00:28:04,380 --> 00:28:05,560
You're not going to say, is it a

779
00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:07,520
traditional IRA or a Roth?

780
00:28:07,540 --> 00:28:08,720
Oh no, it's a traditional.

781
00:28:08,860 --> 00:28:09,400
I don't want it.

782
00:28:09,440 --> 00:28:09,900
Of course not.

783
00:28:10,020 --> 00:28:10,140
Right?

784
00:28:10,260 --> 00:28:10,660
Right.

785
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:16,240
But if you're offered two, with the same

786
00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:19,180
amount of money in each one, pick the

787
00:28:19,180 --> 00:28:22,640
Roth because there's a lot more flexibility and

788
00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:25,160
no taxes to pay if you follow the

789
00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:25,540
rules.

790
00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:29,020
And then when an heir would inherit a

791
00:28:29,020 --> 00:28:31,080
traditional IRA, they have to think about, well,

792
00:28:31,100 --> 00:28:32,660
how much am I taking out each year

793
00:28:32,660 --> 00:28:34,860
so that I'm still within a certain tax

794
00:28:34,860 --> 00:28:35,280
bracket?

795
00:28:35,940 --> 00:28:37,860
It's kind of the same analysis, isn't it?

796
00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:39,800
There's a lot more to consider.

797
00:28:39,940 --> 00:28:40,220
Exactly.

798
00:28:40,220 --> 00:28:42,680
It's the same kind of thinking that goes

799
00:28:42,680 --> 00:28:43,080
into it.

800
00:28:43,180 --> 00:28:46,400
Whereas with the inherited Roth, you need to

801
00:28:46,400 --> 00:28:47,960
still take the money out after 10 years,

802
00:28:48,220 --> 00:28:49,940
but you could take it all at the

803
00:28:49,940 --> 00:28:51,320
10th year, let it grow as much as

804
00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:55,580
possible, and the heir would receive that in

805
00:28:55,580 --> 00:28:56,680
the 10th year and not have to pay

806
00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:57,180
taxes on it.

807
00:28:57,480 --> 00:28:58,740
So pretty good deal.

808
00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:01,860
And again, like you mentioned, if it's not

809
00:29:01,860 --> 00:29:03,900
money that needs to be taken out right

810
00:29:03,900 --> 00:29:05,060
away, all the better.

811
00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:08,540
That would really only make sense if you

812
00:29:08,540 --> 00:29:10,160
did save it for the longer term.

813
00:29:11,820 --> 00:29:14,420
But yeah, I think it's a great option

814
00:29:14,420 --> 00:29:14,900
to consider.

815
00:29:15,060 --> 00:29:16,420
There's a lot that goes into it, and

816
00:29:16,420 --> 00:29:17,640
there's a lot that we can do on

817
00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:20,780
our end on the financial planning side to

818
00:29:20,780 --> 00:29:22,560
model what that might look like and when

819
00:29:22,560 --> 00:29:25,120
it might be a good time to make

820
00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:26,080
that conversion decision.

821
00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:28,760
Yeah, it's a dynamic decision.

822
00:29:28,980 --> 00:29:30,680
It really depends on your circumstances.

823
00:29:31,020 --> 00:29:32,540
You know, we haven't even talked about life

824
00:29:32,540 --> 00:29:33,060
expectancy.

825
00:29:33,060 --> 00:29:35,480
We haven't even talked about a lot of

826
00:29:35,480 --> 00:29:39,140
factors that a good financial planner who knows

827
00:29:39,140 --> 00:29:42,200
you knows all these factors, and they can

828
00:29:42,200 --> 00:29:44,160
decide if it's something you need to think

829
00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:45,840
about, and then they can model it out.

830
00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:47,220
You know, you can actually have software that

831
00:29:47,220 --> 00:29:49,000
can model it out longer term and say,

832
00:29:49,600 --> 00:29:51,300
yes, there's a benefit, or no, I don't

833
00:29:51,300 --> 00:29:51,920
think there is.

834
00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:53,320
So good point.

835
00:29:53,660 --> 00:29:55,860
Any other last thoughts on that article, Jeff,

836
00:29:55,900 --> 00:29:56,840
that come to mind?

837
00:29:57,200 --> 00:29:58,880
No, you know what I'll do, Russ?

838
00:29:58,880 --> 00:30:01,820
I'll throw the article, the link to the

839
00:30:01,820 --> 00:30:03,600
article in the notes of the show.

840
00:30:04,300 --> 00:30:05,500
So if people want to read the whole

841
00:30:05,500 --> 00:30:07,220
article, they can read that.

842
00:30:07,300 --> 00:30:08,640
And also in the notes of the show

843
00:30:08,640 --> 00:30:11,060
is a link to contact Chris Boyd, myself,

844
00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:13,660
or yourself, so we'd love to hear from

845
00:30:13,660 --> 00:30:13,900
you.

846
00:30:14,200 --> 00:30:15,300
And thanks for listening.

847
00:30:15,860 --> 00:30:17,380
And please tune in next time.

848
00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:20,560
Until then, keep striving for something more.

849
00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:24,140
Thank you for listening to Something More with

850
00:30:24,140 --> 00:30:24,860
Chris Boyd.

851
00:30:25,180 --> 00:30:27,320
Call us for help, whether it's for financial

852
00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:31,240
planning or portfolio management, insurance concerns, or those

853
00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:33,280
quality of life issues that make the money

854
00:30:33,280 --> 00:30:34,360
matters matter.

855
00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:38,000
Whatever's on your mind, visit us at somethingmorewithchrisboyd

856
00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:41,200
.com, or call us toll free at 866

857
00:30:41,200 --> 00:30:44,880
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858
00:30:44,980 --> 00:30:48,760
Or send us your questions to amr-info

859
00:30:48,760 --> 00:30:50,680
at wealthenhancement.com.

860
00:30:51,080 --> 00:30:52,800
You're listening to Something More with Chris Boyd

861
00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:55,420
Financial Talk Show, Wealth Enhancement Advisory Services, and

862
00:30:55,420 --> 00:30:57,560
Jay Christopher Boyd provide investment advice on an

863
00:30:57,560 --> 00:30:59,120
individual basis to clients only.

864
00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:01,280
Proper advice depends on a complete analysis of

865
00:31:01,280 --> 00:31:02,460
all facts and circumstances.

866
00:31:02,760 --> 00:31:04,560
The information given on this program is general

867
00:31:04,560 --> 00:31:06,580
financial comments and cannot be relied upon as

868
00:31:06,580 --> 00:31:08,160
pertaining to your specific situation.

869
00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:10,340
Wealth Enhancement Group cannot guarantee that using the

870
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871
00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:13,460
ensure freedom from loss.

872
00:31:13,660 --> 00:31:15,840
Listeners should consult their own financial advisors or

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00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:17,940
conduct their own due diligence before making any

874
00:31:17,940 --> 00:31:18,700
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